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Leaking Renoise Means Losing Your License


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#1 Guest_Bantai_*

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Posted 22 September 2006 - 14:16

We have found that registered copies of Renoise have been leaked.
Additionally, some unregistered users have been begging registered users for sharing their registered copies.

Please don't share your registered version of Renoise with other people.
Every registered version of Renoise is watermarked. Each download is logged.


We will invalidate licenses associated with leaked versions.

In other words, if we find your name on a p2p version, you lose your license.

Thanks for your support! :yeah:

#2 dblue

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Posted 22 September 2006 - 15:09

Damn! :angry:

(Damn about the fact that copies are being leaked)

Edited by dblue, 27 September 2006 - 09:26.


#3 vV

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Posted 22 September 2006 - 16:56

In addition some tips to prevent your copy or login data being shared unawarely.

Ofcourse we consider nobody would just share his/her licensed copy just like that. But don't be fooled by anyone claiming to have lost login (username / password) data and temporary want to use your copy until his password is reset.
There is a supportform for that and we can very quickly reset login passwords.

To prevent having your copies of any form of registered software getting spread:
Tip 1: Never ever store your backstage login data (username and password) in your browser's password cache.
Tip 2: If you use sharing applications (LimeWire / Edonkey / Emule / Shareaza Bittorrent etc.) take care that you don't share folders that contain subfolders which could possibly lead to a downloaded copy of your registered software.
Tip 3:Use antispyware and a good antivirus program on a daily basis. You never know what trojans or keyloggers house on your PC if you underestimate this.
Tip 4: Similar to Tip 2, if you visit LAN parties or are connected to a LAN with other users, make sure you do not share your programs folder by any mistake (like no/stupid password)

EDIT by Pulsar: added Tip 4
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#4 Marc Shake

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Posted 26 September 2006 - 08:19

1st: I can really understand that and I agree. Right now, I am gonna chance my userpassword :)

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#5 Lareux

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 09:20

Hopefully people doesn't share it intentionally. Wish the best of luck and success to the renoise team for creating this awesome product. Unfortunatly even with the best means of copy protection, hackers and crackers will find a way to work around it. I can only hope that if some good will come out of the bad, and the reputation of renoise will spread and hopefully generate more registered users in the end.

/ Cheers to the renoise team.!!!
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#6 Guest_Bantai_*

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 09:29

We are also concerned about people who share unintentionally. A lot of Renoise warez were originally registered to users who accidently put the files in their share folders, to become easy bait for a cracker team.

#7 vV

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 11:54

The only thing that cannot be prevented is cracker-groups that use ten or more members to invest one share and register a copy and then bring it out.
Usually the first Beta is a bait and the first final.
The only protection against that will be system profiles serial generation, dongles and the likes.
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#8 sagosen

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 16:52

The only protection against that will be system profiles serial generation, dongles and the likes.



Please don't go dongle! :huh:

Edited by sagosen, 27 September 2006 - 16:52.


#9 It-Alien

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 17:38

Please don't go dongle! :huh:


please don't share your registered version :)
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#10 vV

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 18:22

Dongle means price increment.
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#11 keith303

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 18:22

well, we all know that dongles have been emulated or cracked as well, many times before.
see cubase sx and other steinberg prods.

#12 vV

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 18:28

Yups but the better cracking groups that used to do this are pretty much dead and remainders from it only do this on personal matters for a lot of money.
I don't think many are willing to drastically shelling out a lot of cash to have the dongle of a 100 euro application cracked unless it is the competitor of the application ;)
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#13 MLoN

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 18:46

dongles are easy to crack so dont go that road.
since renoise is pretty popular the shit gets cracked before you can say 'pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis'.


mlon

#14 vV

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 19:19

I read on the dev-forum syncrosoft dongles seem to be a real pain in the ass to crack. Not uncrackable, but not as easy as you want to make us believe.


Though we were actually discussing a specific dongle with a Renoise Launch-button...
Posted Image
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#15 Djeroek

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 19:41

.

Edited by Djeroek, 09 November 2013 - 03:43.


#16 vV

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 20:28

but imo without the cracks they would never have the exposure to possible sales.

That is the positive side of warez spreading because it makes the application more interesting, faster than trend-setters and marketeers can arrange.
Yet this doesn't mean that nobody should do anything against it...
There need to be some balance between who wins tomorrow and who wins today which will eventually make it a fair trade for most.

We are still waiting for the leaked 1.8.0 to appear on the p2p networks, appearantly someone was pretty lucky that short moment when it was on the p2p networks.(it usually a matter of days for a posted archive on the web to appear on the p2p networks)
Currently the amount of 1.5x shares even have lowered the last few days... (i get a lot less hits in shareaza)
I don't know what this means exactly yet.
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#17 sagosen

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 22:38

I read on the dev-forum syncrosoft dongles seem to be a real pain in the ass to crack. Not uncrackable, but not as easy as you want to make us believe.
Though we were actually discussing a specific dongle with a Renoise Launch-button...
Posted Image


I want this!!!! :D

But yeah, you got a point. Then again, it's cheap enough for most people to buy, and the delete-policy you have now should help.

Then again, you could make it available on Steam? :P

#18 Syflom

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Posted 28 September 2006 - 00:26

Then again, you could make it available on Steam? :P

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#19 vV

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Posted 28 September 2006 - 18:34

Steam license registration?
Hmmz, i remember trying a warez edition of Ragdoll Kung-fu... which played fine and i had a wonderfull funny hour of joy with it, but the point is:steam is not bulletproof.
The only reason steam works well with their other games is mostly because of the multiplayer environment and multi-player only environment:you are required to be online and have your registration checked every time you use the application.
I don't think a professional studio is waiting for an app that requires their computers to be hooked up to the net 24/7 so that their audio apps can run.
And what if the dsl-connection busts out?
Same with steam:you can't own when that happens, productivity downage :P
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#20 futureline

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Posted 28 September 2006 - 19:59

How incredible funny this is. It’s my humble opinion that all software should be free. As more and more people (users and programmers) realize that software should be open and accessible for everyone, the trend is set. It’s only a matter of time when the crackers of today will be the hero’s of tomorrow. Bill Gates was one of a few people who spread the word, that they should ask money for there software. Commerce did the rest. Its time to stop this nonsense and get back to the roots. Programmers making the best programs together with there users. Securing and protection should be left for the government. This money making hype should stop. You started with nothing. You earned respect. Be proud of what you made. And lose the attitude.

We love you program. Now get an GNU General Public License (GPL)

#21 pulsar

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Posted 28 September 2006 - 20:07

ok, this is getting too far.

- FACT: Renoise wont be GPLized
- FACT: no dongles
- FACT: no steam

thank you :)

@futureline: being a developer, how do you make living out of your profession without the "pay for support and/or certificates but take our software for free" model? Obviously such a model cannot work for Renoise but rather for Application-Servers, databases, etc.
// pulsar, renoise slave

#22 Ambivalence

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Posted 28 September 2006 - 21:03

Right now, you're already able to save songs, + even retards can circumvent the demo limits and record the output. If the creators want sales, then this program needs more exposure through marketing, get reviewed in magazines, create some kind of buzz or become 'popular' (could even benefit from a floatin crack). Personally tho, I'd like it to be a smal circle secret of freemasons knowing how to manipulate teh beat :)
Fruityloops has been cracked to death, and that company is still alive with better software every release..sure they suffer, but imo without the cracks they would never have the exposure to possible sales.


Yeah. To be honest, I was one of (many) people that walked around the lack of Wave Rendering. And I'm pretty sure that it was a wise and intentional move by the devs to let people do just that. Come on, how hard would it be to disable master track effects in the demo, add a VST effect blacklist, etc.? Sure, it wouldn't be 100% effective but most of people using it (who are not programmers), would have rendering cut off. But these safety features are not in! Look, many people like me were using the demo on the edge of legality (despite doing no commercial stuff, walking around Wave Rendering smells bad). And at last... I registered. I felt I owe it to the devs, I was getting really annoyed by the realtime recording that was fragile to every CPU peak, I discovered that the full version contains the magic "render selection" function (you got to love that!), and I wanted to be in the 1.8.0 beta stage B) Now I'm trying to be helpful with testing and commenting everything I can.

:guitar: I have an idea... :guitar:

I checked that there are "cracked" or "registered" releases on Gnutella and Edonkey, but I didn't bother to see what's in the packages. I think that registered versions should be timestamped and work for a given amount of time (one month, three months, six months?). That would mean they'd have to be redownloaded every now and then by legal users (but that's hardly a problem, isn't it?) and it would make the leaked versions "trial" really.

About the GPL thing... I'm all for it (even for BSD model which is more free than GPL!) but in case of Renoise we don't talk about an application server, about a compiler collection, about a web browser. We talk about software that enables people to produce music. Some of them make money thanks to it. Others just get a smaller or bigger fan base. The rest does it for pure fun. And take it for granted: releasing Renoise as GPL would not change anything for better for now. Big audio companies would peak at the source code and take ideas from it, the current Renoise devs would lose the reason to be so active in development and support (just see the 1.8 forums, they're full of actual developer activity)

And for the open-source community spirit... Well, look for instance at Psycl e. It's a great music studio with some ideas I personally like very much. But it doesn't help that it's Free. Performance and stability issues, rather slow growth, etc. make it more an experimental project than something you can use for mission critical work. And look: MySQL and many others include a dual-licensing model. What it basically says is: "if you use our system commercially, you fall into the commercial license basket, not the GPL one". So, in reality, many of the more successful open-source projects take money from the commercial users.

Speaking of the dongles: it's a needless hassle. It takes an USB port, it is possible to crack (just type "cubase" on any p2p app). And for the rather small user community of Renoise, it would be more of an inconvenience.

And Steam? Steam works only because the games it supports are using Internet connection constantly. Plus, it is used mostly by games so not much cracking effort is made. See, Renoise could easily do just that: check for the validity of the registered user account at each run. Leaked versions would soon become broken and we'd have our problems solved. But, many audio apps work in environments without an Internet connection at all, or with dial-ups. So a Steam-like solution is poor.

Overall: the license model for Renoise is very generous. The price for a license gets the development and support running. The application is 100% free to try for non-commercial uses (who don't need ASIO anyway and can write to waves in an naive "unsupported" way). I say I go for it! And all of the people that think otherwise should just walk away to another piece of software. Cracking, leaking registered versions, begging for GPL, etc. is just rude and not fair.
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#23 Conner_Bw

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Posted 28 September 2006 - 22:38

I think that registered versions should be timestamped and work for a given amount of time (one month, three months, six months?). That would mean they'd have to be redownloaded every now and then by legal users (but that's hardly a problem, isn't it?) and it would make the leaked versions "trial" really.


Please, please, please, never do this!

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:(

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#24 pulsar

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Posted 28 September 2006 - 22:56

Please, please, please, never do this!

One laptop, one week vacation to the country side, one expired license, zero internet...

:(


this wont happen either.

Renoise does not suffer much from priacy since most of the poeple who bought renoise did it because they like the software and want to support us. There may be a few people who bought it because it was hard to obtain a warezed version - but this is a minority.

Neverless we must stop leaking accounts and discontinue accounts as a consequence.

Stop wild speculations please :)
// pulsar, renoise slave

#25 Ambivalence

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Posted 28 September 2006 - 23:06

OK, we have a clear statement on that one! :) So the thing Renoise.com community (and the developers) should do, is to promote Renoise as a professional, production quality music software. Some people say that trackers are old-school and only for people with FT2/IT experience. That's not true. Trackers can be still the most useful tool for people like me who like to see the composition as a whole structure. Musical notation is too ambigous in many aspects and too much space consuming, while the piano rolls aren't really useful for hand editing.

So a more agressive marketing approach would surely help in getting Renoise's user base grow.

But that's another topic, I guess.
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