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New Tool (2.8) Auto Clone Patterns


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#26 bystrano

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Posted 18 September 2010 - 17:17

Minimum 2 patterns?

That's a strong limitation to me.. And I don't see what you could to with this that you can't do with AutoClone. To me, AutoClone creates a mess in the pattern sequence that you have to clean up after your recordings, and your idea is to create this mess in the tracks instead, but you'll have to clean up anyway. Have I missed something?

#27 Conner_Bw

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Posted 18 September 2010 - 17:20

That's a strong limitation to me.. And I don't see what you could to with this that you can't do with AutoClone. To me, AutoClone creates a mess in the pattern sequence that you have to clean up after your recordings, and your idea is to create this mess in the tracks instead, but you'll have to clean up anyway. Have I missed something?


No, you haven't missed anything. It's just a horizontal AutoClone instead of vertical.

I didn't say the solution was elegant, I just said it could be done with a variation of the current idea in this thread.

Edited by Conner_Bw, 18 September 2010 - 17:21.

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#28 bystrano

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Posted 18 September 2010 - 18:24

No, you haven't missed anything.

Actually, I missed the word "variation".. Sorry if I sounded too critical.

#29 kazakore

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Posted 21 September 2010 - 10:30

That's a strong limitation to me.. And I don't see what you could to with this that you can't do with AutoClone. To me, AutoClone creates a mess in the pattern sequence that you have to clean up after your recordings, and your idea is to create this mess in the tracks instead, but you'll have to clean up anyway. Have I missed something?


I can actually see a lot of benefits to Conner's way. Most notibly, if you are recording over multiple-pattern loop (say 8 patterns) then it is a lot easier to choose takes for each individual pattern which are the best, while auditioning them with the others.

Although the way I see it would use normal Tracks rather than a new kind it seems Conner is proposing.

You want to take X number of passes. Clone Current Pattern X amount of times (including DSPs.) Mute all newly created Tracks. When you reach end of Loop move to next track and Mute the previous track.

Although don't we have the issues of Song Position Data maybe not being accurate for this?

This way also helps a lot if you have long samples which rely on the new AutoSeek, even if only a single pattern recording. With current method you would have to move each pattern to the correct position to see how it sounds with the sample playing the correct position. With this method you just unmute the track you want to hear.

#30 Conner_Bw

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Posted 22 September 2010 - 15:41

Before this gets totally derailed, maybe AutoClonePatterns_v0.4.xrnx is ready for the tools page and everything else is another thread?

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#31 bystrano

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 07:56

Before this gets totally derailed, maybe AutoClonePatterns_v0.4.xrnx is ready for the tools page and everything else is another thread?

Yep, I just uploaded version v0.5, which is pretty much the same as 0.4, but it remembers its state when renoise is quit, meaning you don't have to enable it everytime you launch renoise.
I submitted it to the tool page too, it's waiting for approval..

#32 danoise

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Posted 25 September 2010 - 12:23

This is very cool, but IMHO a little modification would make it even better. Please correct me if the following is already possible:

Say that the looped region contains the "fundamentals", some groove that you wish to record on top of.
Currently, the playback must enter the last pattern of the looped region before the auto-clone happens. This means that you are in fact recording something into the "fundamentals", which is then carried over to the next take, and the next etc., overdubbing style.

Wouldn't it be more useful if the cloning happened *when* you entered the looped region? Perhaps this is not the intention of this tool?

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#33 Conner_Bw

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Posted 25 September 2010 - 14:04

Currently, the playback must enter the last pattern of the looped region before the auto-clone happens. This means that you are in fact recording something into the "fundamentals", which is then carried over to the next take, and the next etc., overdubbing style.


The current track is always deleted on clone, and renoise can only record to 1 track, so nothing gets carried over?

Did you not try the tool?

Edited by Conner_Bw, 25 September 2010 - 14:05.

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#34 danoise

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Posted 25 September 2010 - 16:29

OK, somehow I got the idea that multiple looped patterns were supported.

I'm guessing all it would take is for the cloning to happen when playback enter the first looped pattern, instead of the last one. Would it be too much to ask for? Posted Image

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#35 Conner_Bw

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Posted 25 September 2010 - 16:40

Multiple patterns are supported.

I'm a little confused? Is there a situation where how it works now doesn't do what you expect? Or you would just rather it behave a different way?

Code wise it's easy. Change line 81 from

[lua]
if renoise.song().transport.playback_pos.sequence == loop_end then
[/lua]

To:

[lua]
if renoise.song().transport.playback_pos.sequence == loop_start then
[/lua]


This should be a preference though, because I prefer the way it works now.

Furthermore, I'm not the author so this is merely an opinion.

Did you use the tool? Or what?

Edited by Conner_Bw, 25 September 2010 - 16:41.

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#36 Conner_Bw

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Posted 25 September 2010 - 16:54

Ok I understand your issue now, I think?

This tool is meant to jam on a new track, it's implied that the track you are recording on is empty. It supports X patterns, no problem. Once you reach the end of your jam, if you want to keep going, tada!

In your case, you have looped X patterns, where every track is full, and you want to create a clone and clear the track automatically before starting to jam.

Am i right?

Edited by Conner_Bw, 25 September 2010 - 16:57.

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#37 danoise

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Posted 25 September 2010 - 17:21

Changing that line worked perfectly, thanks!

Let me try to explain what I didn't want: the problem is that auto-cloning happens at the last pattern of the looped region, and I have just recorded something into those patterns when the cloning takes place.

But with the cloning happening before we enter the looped region, my backing track is perfectly intact and I can keep playing new stuff for as long as I want (just like how it works with a single pattern).

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#38 bystrano

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Posted 25 September 2010 - 21:06

I agree that this behavior is odd, I didn't think about it this way... It made me realise that this tool will behave even more oddly if you change tracks during your recording, which can definitly happen when jamming over multiple patterns.

I will work a bit on this and release a new version soon.

#39 bystrano

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Posted 26 September 2010 - 09:59

I just uploaded a new version, v0.6 on the tools page.
The cloning now happens at the beginning of the recording, as suggested by Danoise. It doesn't clear the currently selected track in the clone anymore, since it's no more needed. This makes the tool more consistent if you happen to change track during your recording.
After a recording, you will have an unaltered version of your loop after your recorded patterns. But you may also not want to keep it, so I added an option in the Tools menu that will automatically delete these unaltered patterns on rec stop.

What do you think, is it better like this?

EDIT : I just noticed the tool has to be validated again before it appears on the tool page. I added it as an attachement, so you can test it before it's validated.

Edited by bystrano, 26 September 2010 - 19:19.


#40 danoise

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Posted 26 September 2010 - 11:29

Yes sir! Works like a charm. I will be using this tool a LOT

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#41 Djeroek

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Posted 26 September 2010 - 12:11

thanks for the update bystrano!

#42 danoise

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Posted 26 September 2010 - 14:39

OK wait a moment...now it just started taking clones even when I had it disabled? Investigate...

Edit: yep, edit mode gets stuck when you leave it on while disabling the tool.

Edited by danoise, 26 September 2010 - 16:33.

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#43 bystrano

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Posted 26 September 2010 - 19:27

OK wait a moment...now it just started taking clones even when I had it disabled? Investigate...

Edit: yep, edit mode gets stuck when you leave it on while disabling the tool.

This should be fixed in v0.7. Thanks for the report!

Attached Files



#44 Conner_Bw

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Posted 26 September 2010 - 20:29

Found some bugs in version 0.7

Not sure how this happened? But, at one point clones were occurring even though record mode was off and patterns was jumping all over.

1)
*** std::logic_error: 'invalid sequence_pos index '0'. valid values are (1-2).'
*** stack traceback:
***   [C]: in function 'delete_sequence_at'
***   main.lua:83: in function <main.lua:66>

2)
Create a new song with two patterns
Put the last pattern into loop mode
In the script: Enable, Delete Unused Clones
Move to first pattern in sequence
Start recording, stop recording (never reach the second pattern)

Expected:
Loop isn't deleted, because it was never cloned.

Actual:
Loop is deleted.

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#45 bystrano

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Posted 26 September 2010 - 21:19

Found some bugs in version 0.7

Looks like I posted the v0.7 too fast, sorry... 1) and 2) should be fixed in v0.8.

Not sure how this happened? But, at one point clones were occurring even though record mode was off and patterns was jumping all over.

I fixed a bug that could lead to this, so hopefully it's fixed too...

Edited by bystrano, 27 September 2010 - 07:19.


#46 RANSOM

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Posted 28 September 2010 - 21:32

How to use this tool? Please help. Any manual welcome. Better the video.

#47 bystrano

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Posted 28 September 2010 - 23:43

How to use this tool?

Step 1. Create a loop of patterns in the pattern matrix sequence editor. You do that by clicking the buttons on the left of the pattern numbers.

Step 2. Go in the tools menu, select AutoClonePatterns and enable.

Step 3. Play the loop and record some notes. As soon as you begin to record, the loop will be automatically cloned in the pattern matrix sequence editor, allowing you to jam on the same loop as long as you want without overwriting any of your performance.

Hope it helps..

Edited by bystrano, 30 September 2010 - 12:12.


#48 RANSOM

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Posted 29 September 2010 - 08:34

Step 1. Create a loop of patterns in the pattern matrix. You do that by clicking the buttons on the left of the pattern numbers.

Step 2. Go in the tools menu, select AutoClonePatterns and enable.

Step 3. Play the loop and record some notes. As soon as you begin to record, the loop will be automatically cloned in the pattern matrix, allowing you to jam on the same loop as long as you want without overwriting any of your performance.

Hope it helps..


Thanks a lot Bystrano. It works!

p.s. But i`ve expected a little different thing, anyway thanks, this is useful too.

#49 kazakore

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Posted 30 September 2010 - 11:32

Step 1. Create a loop of patterns in the pattern matrix. You do that by clicking the buttons on the left of the pattern numbers.


I have been wondering if people actually mean this when they've been saying loop in the Matrix. This area is actually the Sequence Editor and has a separate focus etc to the Matrix (unless that has changed with 2.6)

#50 bystrano

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Posted 30 September 2010 - 12:10

I have been wondering if people actually mean this when they've been saying loop in the Matrix. This area is actually the Sequence Editor and has a separate focus etc to the Matrix (unless that has changed with 2.6)

Yep, you're right. I've been using renoise since 2.5, so I have always seen them both together. That's why they were the same thing in my mind.. till now!