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How do I automate the Repeater device correctly?


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#1 m.arthur

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Posted 13 January 2018 - 04:53

I'm trying to use Repeater in my track and it's not working out how I'd like, I need some help!

 

1. I have repeater inside an instrument effects chain, and have some hats assigned to the chain.

 

2. the hats are already recorded into a pattern. Now, I've assigned a Macro to control the "divisor" of repeater.

 

3. I add an instrument Macro to the track with the instrument, so I can control my Divisor macro and record automation of it.

 

4. Repeater is on "off" by default, so I select an "on" setting, in this case "even"

 

5. I playback my sequence and then Right-click and hold my Macro Divisor, move it around a bit. The automation gets recorded into my track as expected. 

 

6. I playback the sequence with the recorded automation. The Macro / Divisor value  jumps around as expected, but the Repeater device has turned itself Off when playback was stopped, so the effect of the device isn't heard. I have to manually turn it on again to hear the recorded automation, but every time I hit stop, the Repeater turns itself off again.

 

So what am I missing here? There must be some other step for automating the divisor value? Or some other way to have the repeater turn On every time the automation is read? I don't get it...

 

thanks!

 

-m.arthur


Edited by m.arthur, 13 January 2018 - 04:53.

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#2 dblue

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Posted 13 January 2018 - 07:23

To "arm" the Repeater you must first switch the Mode from the default "Off" state to one of the active modes instead, such as "Even".

This starts the process of capturing the audio input and simultaneously repeating it back through the output, and then you can also tweak the Divisor to your liking.

To capture a different sound you must temporarily switch the Mode to "Off", and then switch it back on again at the desired point in time.

When the transport stops, the Repeater automatically reverts back to the default "Off" state, otherwise it would continue repeating its audio buffer endlessly.

Basically, the Mode and Divisor parameters rely on each other to function correctly and set the effect in motion, so you will need to automate both of them together.

When you play around with the Repeater's interface in realtime, notice that both the Mode and Divisor parameters change together.

Likewise, if you right-click the on the different timings in the grid, it will also record automation for both parameters.
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#3 Neurogami

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Posted 13 January 2018 - 19:25

What dblue said.

 

Also, while I dont have an example handy, I've seen good use of using an LFO to drive the state of the repeater (perhaps one to toggle the mode and another to manipulate the divisor).    


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#4 m.arthur

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Posted 13 January 2018 - 19:36

Awesome info guys, thanks! It makes sense to me now, how I need to automate both the divisor and the mode to get the automation working properly -- and as dblue has suggested, I can simply right-click the timing boxes to have it input automation for both. Excellent!

 

LFO idea is interested, I'll mess with it, though for this kind of thing LFO modulation might feel to cyclic and obvious... though I could mess with Random or custom LFOs, I suppose.

 

thanks!


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#5 danoise

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Posted 13 January 2018 - 20:22

LFO modulation might feel to cyclic and obvious... though I could mess with Random or custom LFOs, I suppose.

 

Try thinking in terms of "proxies". 

What I mean is, I often automate parameters through an LFO, even when I strictly speaking don't need one. 

Having an LFO on board gives me the ability to make "normal" automation, but add a little bit of chaos and modulation whenever I see fit (this is much harder to do afterwards). 


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#6 Esox

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Posted 14 January 2018 - 10:12

I would like to add my question over this topic...

 

I had to take time to understand that you have to automate both parameters so that the repeater works properly. Yet, I still face a problem : When I want to automate that repeater on a channel, it seems to always stick to the first entered value.

 

I mean when I play the sound and tweak the amount of divisor I can produce really cool kind of glitch effects, but if I try to automate the same thing, it will stick to the first amount of division entered, and in the audio you don't hear that "glitch" effects anymore... Any idea or advice ?



#7 m.arthur

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Posted 15 January 2018 - 07:58

Esox -- sounds like you have Pattern Follow turned off. Turn it on (the button to the left of the Metronome button) and try recording your automation again - now it should continue recording across successive lines, as you're expecting. Unfortunately with Pattern Follow off, you can't record it across the full sequence, it will only enter a value on a single line, as you've noticed.

 

-M

 

 

I would like to add my question over this topic...

 

I had to take time to understand that you have to automate both parameters so that the repeater works properly. Yet, I still face a problem : When I want to automate that repeater on a channel, it seems to always stick to the first entered value.

 

I mean when I play the sound and tweak the amount of divisor I can produce really cool kind of glitch effects, but if I try to automate the same thing, it will stick to the first amount of division entered, and in the audio you don't hear that "glitch" effects anymore... Any idea or advice ?


old-school industrial music:  dead when i found her

 


#8 Esox

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Posted 15 January 2018 - 09:54

Thanks m.arthur,

 

I forgot to mention that I dont use automation on lines within the pattern, but on enveloppes. There I "manually" add enveloppe points to create smooth transitions, but it doesn't act like I want it most of the time.

 

Anyway I guess that might be the same issue, I'll try it soon, thank you for the advice.

 

Thanks :)



#9 danoise

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Posted 15 January 2018 - 11:46

I forgot to mention that I dont use automation on lines within the pattern, but on enveloppes. There I "manually" add enveloppe points to create smooth transitions, but it doesn't act like I want it most of the time.

 

How do you want it to act? 

Point mode is probably the best - most accurate - type of automation for this device, as we are dealing with discrete values (steps). But yeah, it's a tricky one to automate. 

 

If you want to live-record those cool glitches, it could also be worth checking out this formula device:

http://forum.renoise...6-linequantize/

 

It's able to quantize parameter movements over time, enabling changes to happen *exactly* at the line/beat/bar etc. 


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#10 Esox

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Posted 17 January 2018 - 09:38

Thanks Danoise.

 

At the moment I'm not dealing with it at all, and I do not have any track atm on which I'm using this effect. But I remember I wanted to use it when I first started using Renoise a few months ago, because it can produce cool sounds and effects. But because of these problems of automation, I turned to using Dblue's Glitch Vst, which has a repeating function too and works usually better with automation than the repeater.

 

But once again maybe that's because of the way I proceed and maybe that's all my fault indeed.

 

If I get the opportunity I will create a short soundtrack with a demo on how it acts while automated and then post it here...