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Keyboard offset bug?


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#1 Darlo

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Posted 14 February 2018 - 22:39

Hi,

 

Trying to use offset option in Redux with Bitwig. Not sure if there is an issue with Redux or my understanding.

 

Assuming a 127 line phrase.

 

C -2 => line 0

G 8  => line 127

 

Theory  holds until D - 1 => line 14 then D# -1  = > line16. Is this a bug or how Redux should behave?

 

 

 

 



#2 TheBellows

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Posted 15 February 2018 - 16:52

Hi,

Trying to use offset option in Redux with Bitwig. Not sure if there is an issue with Redux or my understanding.

Assuming a 127 line phrase.

C -2 => line 0
G 8 => line 127

Theory holds until D - 1 => line 14 then D# -1 = > line16. Is this a bug or how Redux should behave?


I don't even understand what you mean with 'use offset option'? What do you want to offset?
Do you want to offset a sample in the phrase editor? If so i assume you have misunderstood something.
You're mentioning different notes on different lines and 127 line phrase which i assume is supposed to be a 128 line phrase? Why is C -2 => line 0 and G 8 => line 127 i don't understand?
What kind of theory are you talking about?

My best guess is that you have sliced up a beat sample into 60 slices and now you wonder why it's now off beat when you plot them in the phrase editor?

Please explain a bit better what you want to achieve and we'll probably be able to help you out with the issue. ☺

Edited by TheBellows, 15 February 2018 - 17:12.


#3 Darlo

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 09:10

Hi there,

 

Happy to expand.

 

The section of the phrase editor shown in the far right of the image below.

 

Dux1.0_phrases-phraseproperties.png

 

According to the wiki:

 

Key Tracking: Sets the behaviour of the phrase across a key range.

  • None: The phrase is played exactly the same for all keys.
  • Transpose: The pitch of the phrase's notes are transposed to the key played. The playback speed of the phrase is unaffected.
  • Offset: Different keys will cause the phrase to begin playing from different lines (lower keys from earlier in the phrase, higher keys from later).

 

Assuming you have sliced break in  a phrase that is 128 (Sorry my bad not 127)  lines. Reading what the wiki states, I would have a expected that each key on the DAW's piano roll would make a line from 0-127 (c-2 (0) through to G8 (127)). So in theory if you map where the slices are in the phrase to the piano roll, you should be able to trigger the phrase starting from any slice.  

 

When in fact D - 1 => line 14 then D# -1  = > line16 and not line 15 which pushes out the notes you expect a slice to start from when using the phrase editor in key tracking offset mode.

 

 

Hope this helps


Edited by Darlo, 16 February 2018 - 09:13.


#4 danoise

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 11:47

Assuming you have sliced break in  a phrase that is 128 (Sorry my bad not 127)  lines. Reading what the wiki states, I would have a expected that each key on the DAW's piano roll would make a line from 0-127 (c-2 (0) through to G8 (127)). So in theory if you map where the slices are in the phrase to the piano roll, you should be able to trigger the phrase starting from any slice.

 

The problem is that even though the phrase is using the entire keyboard range, this is still not enough to reach every single slice/line in your phrase (108 notes vs. 128 lines). 
 
So, you'll have to compromise by either creating a custom keyrange that allows triggering every second line, or by splitting the phrase in two. 

I would probably go for the first option - this is usually OK if you don't need to trigger "offbeat" parts. 

 

To make a custom keyrange assignment you first need to make sure you're using Keymap mode: 

 

3.1_phrases-controls.png

Phrase bank in Program mode. You want to click "Keymap"

 

Then you can assign the phrase to a specific range on the keyboard which aligns better with the number of lines in your phrase. 

Do this by dragging the phrase onto the keyboard:

 

3.1_phrases-keymap.png

Note that this is just an example image - you want to assign to the range spanning from e.g. C-0 to E-5

 

This should make you able to reach every second line. And, since there's still room left you could add additional phrases to the layout.  

 

Hope this helps!


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#5 Darlo

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 19:14

Hi,

 

Thanks for taking the time to reply. I'm sure there is something I'm missing.

Bitwig my main DAW has C-2 to G8 as it's piano roll and that maps to below.

 

 

logic-midi-note-numbers.png

 

 

 

So in Redux I assumed that 1 note on DAW = 1 line using keyboard offset.

 

Is that note the case?


Edited by Darlo, 16 February 2018 - 19:15.


#6 danoise

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 19:21

Bitwig my main DAW has C-2 to G8 as it's piano roll and that maps to below.

 

Renoise / Redux stops short of the full range. The chart you posted has additional keys, which _would_ have allowed access to 128 lines. 

But if you look at the keyboard in Redux, it covers C-0 through B-9. 


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#7 Darlo

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 20:45

Thanks for clearing this up for me.