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Global Groove sliders go to 100%, is max swing really 75%?

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#1 lettuce

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Posted 17 June 2018 - 01:06

The global groove sliders all go to 100%, but most software and hardware has a maximum swing of 75% ( I think that is dotted 16ths? ).

 

Is the maximum swing which the global groove sliders applies really 75% as well?



#2 fladd

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Posted 17 June 2018 - 19:53

Hi,

 

I think dblue once explained very well how the current global groove implementation works: https://forum.renois...ove#entry361226.

 

This (I hope) should answer this and your other question in the other thread.



#3 lettuce

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Posted 18 June 2018 - 00:25

Thankyou for pointing me in the right direction.

I understand global groove now.

 

Basically, 100% on all global groove sliders will give a 66.40625% swing ( only 256 discrete values, cannot represent fractions such as 1/3 or 2/3 with total accuracy ). This is a nice sounding level of swing, very useable.

 

Having said this I may just stick to using delay commands so that I can sample from other trackers and keep the same swing in renoise.

Actually, I will even stick to normal delay commands based swing, rather than super accurate delay column commands swing ( 256ths of a line ) because my other trackers ( which I will be sampling swung patterns from ) do not have the delay column delay commands accuracy, only ticks not 256ths of a line.

 

The two tools from the other thread are great for understanding both global groove swing and delay column delay command swing ( they are basically the same ).

 

org.illformed.GrooveCalculator.xrnx

https://www.renoise....</span>-control

 

As for the issue of swung triplets, I now believe that when using 12LPB, if 16ths are swung by delay commands in the master track, it matters not when some notes from the triplet do not fall into alignment with the delay commands, but when they do, the triplet will be a swung triplet. That is my belief. You can only use 12LPB patterns to achieve properly swung triplets because if you have already used delay commands in the creation of triplets, they will clash with swung 16ths by delay commands in the master track.

 

If you use 12 LPB, once you have the 16ths swung properly in the master track, just use triplets as normal. Sometimes a delay command will be on an empty line. Doesnt matter, just ignore it. like this

 

TPL-12 LPB-12 ( 144ppqn, 72 ticks per 8th note )

75% swing ( 1st 16th note - 54 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 18 ticks )

(  -- Qxx commands are in master track -- )

 

00  C-4 00 -- ----

01  --- -- -- ----

02  --- -- -- ----

03  --- -- -- ----

04  --- -- -- ----Q06

05  --- -- -- ----

06  --- -- -- ----

07  --- -- -- ----

08  C-4 00 -- ----

09  --- -- -- ----

10  --- -- -- ----Q06

11  --- -- -- ----

12  --- -- -- ----

13  --- -- -- ----

14  --- -- -- ----

15  --- -- -- ----

16  C-4 00 -- ----Q06

17  --- -- -- ----

18  --- -- -- ----

19  --- -- -- ----

20  --- -- -- ----

21  --- -- -- ----

22  --- -- -- ----Q06

23  --- -- -- ----

24  C-4 00 -- ----

25  --- -- -- ----

26  --- -- -- ----

27  --- -- -- ----

28  --- -- -- ----Q06

29  --- -- -- ----

30  --- -- -- ----

31  --- -- -- ----

32  C-4 00 -- ----

33  --- -- -- ----

34  --- -- -- ----Q06

35  --- -- -- ----

36  --- -- -- ----

37  --- -- -- ----

38  --- -- -- ----

39  --- -- -- ----

40  C-4 00 -- ----Q06

41  --- -- -- ----

42  --- -- -- ----

43  --- -- -- ----

44  --- -- -- ----

45  --- -- -- ----

46  --- -- -- ----Q06

47  --- -- -- ----

 

 

Heres the details of both normal delay commands swings and delay column delay commands swings ...I think these settings will be closest to roger linn swng -- TPL-12 LPB-8 ( 96ppqn, 48 ticks per 8th note )...because 96ppqn. But 12LPB must be used to swing triplets properly, that is my belief...It makes me think triplets on Roger Linn machines, such as MPCs were not actually swung triplets, even with swing on!!! As for other tuplets, it depends on phrases being swung somehow.

 

ROGER LINN MPC-STYLE SWING VARIATIONS : DELAYING THE SECOND 16TH NOTE IN EVERY 8TH NOTE

SWING VARIATIONS USING DELAY NOTE BY XX TICKS COMMAND ( 0Qxx ) :

TPL-12 LPB-4 ( 48ppqn, 24 ticks per 8th note )

 

50% ( 1st 16th note - 12 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 12 ticks )

54.166666666666664% ( 1st 16th note - 13 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 11 ticks )

58.333333333333336% ( 1st 16th note - 14 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 10 ticks )
60%?? ( 1st 16th note - 14 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 10 ticks )
--60% is not possible at this resolution ( this is the same as the last 58.333333333333336%, 14 ticks )--

62.5% ( 1st 16th note - 15 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 9 ticks )

66.66666666666666% ( 1st 16th note - 16 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 8 ticks )

70.83333333333334% ( 1st 16th note - 17 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 7 ticks )

75% ( 1st 16th note - 18 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 6 ticks )

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

TPL-12 LPB-8 ( 96ppqn, 48 ticks per 8th note )


50% ( 1st 16th note - 24 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 24 ticks )

54.166666666666664% ( 1st 16th note - 26 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 22 ticks )

58.333333333333336% ( 1st 16th note - 28 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 20 ticks )

60.416666666666664% ( 1st 16th note - 29 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 19 ticks )

62.5% ( 1st 16th note - 30 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 18 ticks )

66.66666666666666% ( 1st 16th note - 32 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 16 ticks )
70.83333333333334% ( 1st 16th note - 34 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 14 ticks )

75% ( 1st 16th note - 36 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 12 ticks )

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

TPL-12 LPB-12 ( 144ppqn, 72 ticks per 8th note )


50% ( 1st 16th note - 36 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 36 ticks )

54.166666666666664% ( 1st 16th note - 39 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 33 ticks )

58.333333333333336% ( 1st 16th note - 42 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 30 ticks )

61.111111111111114% ( 1st 16th note - 44 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 28 ticks )

62.5% ( 1st 16th note - 45 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 27 ticks )

66.66666666666666% ( 1st 16th note - 48 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 24 ticks )

70.83333333333334% ( 1st 16th note - 51 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 21 ticks )

75% ( 1st 16th note - 54 ticks / 2nd 16th note - 18 ticks )

 

-----------------------------------------------------------------

-----------------------------------------------------------------

 

ROGER LINN MPC-STYLE SWING VARIATIONS : DELAYING THE SECOND 16TH NOTE IN EVERY 8TH NOTE

SWING VARIATIONS USING DELAY COLUMN ( 256ths OF A LINE ) :

TPL-12 LPB-4 ( 48ppqn, 1024 delay units per quarter note, 512 delay units per 8th note )


50% ( 1st 16th note - 256 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 256 delay units )

54.1015625% ( 1st 16th note - 277 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 235 delay units )

58.0078125% ( 1st 16th note - 297 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 215 delay units )

60.15625% ( 1st 16th note - 308 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 204 delay units )

62.109375% ( 1st 16th note - 318 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 194 delay units )

66.015625% ( 1st 16th note - 338 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 174 delay units )

70.1171875% ( 1st 16th note - 359 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 153 delay units )
75% ( 1st 16th note - 384 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 128 delay units )

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

TPL-12 LPB-8 ( 96ppqn, 2048 delay units per quarter note, 1024 delay units per 8th note )

50% ( 1st 16th note - 512 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 512 delay units )

54.00390625% ( 1st 16th note - 553 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 471 delay units )

58.0078125% ( 1st 16th note - 594 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 430 delay units )

60.0585937% ( 1st 16th note - 615 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 409 delay units )
62.01171875% ( 1st 16th note - 635 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 389 delay units )

66.015625% ( 1st 16th note - 676 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 348 delay units )

70.01953125% ( 1st 16th note - 717 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 307 delay units )

75% ( 1st 16th note - 768 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 256 delay units )

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

TPL-12 LPB-12 ( 144ppqn, 3072 delay units per quarter note, 1536 delay units per 8th note )

50% ( 1st 16th note - 768 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 768 delay units )

54.036458333333336% ( 1st 16th note - 830 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 706 delay units )

58.0078125% ( 1st 16th note - 891 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 645 delay units )

60.026041666666664% ( 1st 16th note - 922 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 614 delay units )

62.044270833333336% ( 1st 16th note - 953 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 583 delay units )

66.015625% ( 1st 16th note - 1014 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 522 delay units )

70.05208333333334% ( 1st 16th note - 1076 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 460 delay units )

75% ( 1st 16th note - 1152 delay units / 2nd 16th note - 384 delay units )


Edited by lettuce, 18 June 2018 - 02:01.






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