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Random Envelope Creation Per Note


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#1 Redman

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Posted 14 November 2018 - 20:08

In his video, around the 5:45 minute mark, Woulg uses a Max4Live patch he created to draw random envelopes every time he triggers a midi note inside of Ableton which he uses to control delay parameters. As I don't have Ableton I'm wondering would it possible to replicate this in Renoise somehow with like a workaround maybe? I'm assuming it'd be possible to create some kind of tool that could do it but I can't code at all so there's no way I'd be able to make it  :unsure:

 



#2 danoise

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Posted 14 November 2018 - 21:57

One way of doing it: 

 

Using a little trick to embed an Instr. Macro device into the effects section and let it control some envelope (modulation) devices.

The Macros themselves are randomized using the tried-and-tested Key-Tracker --> LFO device combination.

 

Note that there's 2x the Key-tracker --> LFO combination. A single pair seemed a little dull..  ^_^

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#3 Redman

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Posted 15 November 2018 - 01:57

Ah yeah I actually already now about that trick. I use it on hi-hats sometimes to humanize velocity randomly. The problem is that it only works on a samples modulation section, I want to create random envelopes that control effects and plugins settings like delay time, chorus depth, etc with every single new midi note.

 

So far the only workaround I've come up with is using a custom envelope drawn into an LFO device with really long length i.e 512 lines to control the effect setting I want, and then randomly switching it on and off with another key-tracked LFO set to random. 

 

So the chain is:

Key Tracker - Random LFO (Freq INF LPC) - Custom (512 Line Envelope) LFO - Delay Time

 

Basically then what happens is the custom LFO scrolls through it's envelope and is randomly turned on and off each time a midi note is triggered, when the custom LFO gets turned off it pauses scrolling through the envelope wherever it stops, and when it turns back on again it begins scrolling from it's last position. At least watching it that's what it seems to do, maybe I'm wrong. But basically what this means then is that each time the custom LFO gets activated it starts from a new point in the envelope, and as it's randomly switched on and off by chance it can remain on for 2, 6, 1, 3, or however main midi note triggers meaning it's playback position will be paused and resumed at random points each time.

 

However the main problems though with this is that doesn't trigger on every single note, it only triggers based on whatever percentage you set the Random LFO (Freq INF LPC) to i.e 50% only triggers it on 50% of the time. So if I run a sound through through this setup, I will 50% of the time get a custom envelope shape that affects the delay time and the other 50% of the time I will get no effect to the delay time. Setting the Random LFO (Freq INF LPC) to 100% would be no good as the custom LFO would be constantly active with each midi note trigger, scrolling continuously and therefore never stopping and starting at a new playback position in the envelope. As well as this the actual envelope never truly changes with each midi note trigger, it is simply selecting a small section from one long predefined shape.

 

That being said it's not a bad little setup. I really just wanted to create what Woulg had done for sound design purposes and not composition so I can still use this setup and simply re-sample the results. But I would still love to be able to do exactly as Woulg did but in Renoise, cause I'm not forking out a fucking mental amount of cash for Ableton and Max4Live just for one device to glitch sounds with.

 

Anyways here's the file with the setup I came up with. Maybe someone can come up with another solution.

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Edited by Redman, 15 November 2018 - 02:04.

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#4 gentleclockdivider

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Posted 15 November 2018 - 12:23

You can actually just draw a dc offset sample and use it to control  hydra 
Here kick ,hat , snare are assigned to keys cde , the I rendered an empty pattern converted to mono an assigned it to key f,g,a  ,

used another one and assigned it to key G ( thus 3  hand drawn controlled envelopes )  to control a hydra which in turn controlled the delay parameter .

Play around with envelope follower sensitivity parameter , or alter the ( control ) envelopes in real time ( like drawing )

 

Playing it realtime is also ace ,just hold/switch  the key that you moulation envelopes and bang in the pattern real time >

Ahh renoise  :drummer:

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Edited by gentleclockdivider, 15 November 2018 - 12:45.

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#5 Redman

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Posted 15 November 2018 - 12:43

You can actually just draw a dc offset sample and use it to control  hydra 
Here kick ,hat , snare are assigned to keys cde , the I rendered an empyt pattern converted to mono an assigned it to key f  ,

used another one and assigned it to key G ( thus 2 hand drawn controlled envelopes )  to control a hydra which in turn controlled the delay parameter .

Play around with envelope follower sensitivity parameter , or alter the ( control ) envelopes in real time ( like drawing )

 

Nice!!!! I can't believe I never thought to do this myself. I can even extended it further by creating dozens of random envelopes and then triggering them using the maybe command, or overlapping them in the keyzone on one note and setting it random playback. Excellent trick man



#6 gentleclockdivider

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Posted 15 November 2018 - 13:06

yep , dc samples are usefull for lots of things , pinging filters etc 
You could also use them to control the amplitude of a ring mod ,stacking multiple ringmods for additive synthesis ,and draw in your envelopes in the sample editor 

You don't always need an envelope follower to exctract the control data from the pure dc waveform ,depending on what you want to control ,  

 

Be cautious that the dc envelopes are not routed directly to renoise's output , because this will cause a huge dc offset on top of the rest 
Just experiment !


Edited by gentleclockdivider, 15 November 2018 - 13:08.

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