Please Help. Renoise And Kore.

Help, Support & Bugs Beginners Questions - Renoise
1

Hey, i’m new to this, and i’m just trying to figure out if it can do everything i want it to do, seems pretty awesome so far. but…

I have kore, and i want to automate something using my kore controller. how is this done? for anyone that is familiar with kore, in the actual plugin window i can move the knobs on the controller, and it moves the associated knob in the software. i read somewhere that renoise does not automate directly from the vst window but instead you have to load up the automation device and move the slider in renoise. i have done that and can automate fine that way, but i want to use my kore controller to shape the sound, and i have gotten to the point where i can move the knob, and it moves the associated parameter slider IN renoise, i just can not figure out how to record this movement into the automation envelope or pattern window due to the fact that i’m not using the right mouse trick to move it.

to save anyone the trouble, loading up kore as a midi controller and mapping the controllers to the sliders is not possible, as kore uses hi-rez controllers dedicated solely to kore software, so my only option is to control the plugin, nothing else. I JUST NEED TO KNOW HOW TO RECORD THAT SLIDER!!! IT’S MOVING, I JUST NEED THE SOFTWARE TO PICK IT UP!!! haha…can you tell i’m pulling my hair out?

but anyways, IS THIS POSSIBLE?? if it is, could somebody walk me through the correct way to do it?

if all else fails i can use my mouse to automate, but the 8 knobs on my kore controller are critical to my workflow and performance…so it would be nice to be able to use it.

thankyou all kindly for any help.

2

You cannot get values into the automation from within the plugin itself. If you rightclick on the slider of the automate device in Renoise the value underneath the slider is either written to the pattern editor or the automation window .
This depends on what you have toggled that button to.

That is the only thing to thoroughly check and then you should be all set to go.

Just rightclick and drag the slider and let go at the value that sounds right to you.

3

ya i knew about the right clicking thing already, that doesn’t help my situation. i guess kore is unique in the fact that it ONLY controls the plugin, nothing else, therefore if you can not record automation in the plugin, then you can’t record any hands-on movement on the kore hardware. that is somewhat of a bummer, but i guess that is ok, i can use kore with other software still.

it’s just kind of a tease because i can get the controller to move the slider in renoise, yet there is no way to record that slider’s movement outside of the right-click-drag maneuver.

any idea if plugin control automation from within the plugin will be integrated any time soon?

thankyou again for the detailed info. it didn’t solve my problem, but i appreciate the help.

4

If you get the slider to move in Renoise, you should be able to record the movement.

5

how? i can’t. you would think you can, but i can’t figure it out. but then again, i’m new to this, so i could be missing something. only thing i can find is to use the right mouse button and drag to write to envelope.

6

I’m not sure why this isn’t working… I don’t have Kore and can not confirm this. To me, it should also work.

On the other hand, you could use midi routing and control the sliders with kore from outside of Renoise.

See:
http://tutorials.renoise.com/Renoise/MIDIMapping
http://www.renoise.com/indepth/tutorials/a…ng-for-renoise/

The idea would be to have Kore midi-mapped to your slider, then you press record in renoise, then you go to the program that is running kore, then you move the kore knobs.

7

dude i’m not yelling at you or anything, i’m just gonna type this in big font so people notice it:

THE KORE CONTROLLER DOES NOT SEND MIDI MESSAGES!

the kore controller has 8 knobs that send a hi-rez message (i don’t know what it is, something that native instruments has coded, but it is not midi). This message is ONLY detected by the kore software. The Kore controller is great, but you can not use it for anything other than the kore software. This means i can not use the Kore controller to control anything in renoise.

Instead i work in the other direction, i control the software plugin, and when something is changed in the software, it is in sync with renoise, and the fader in renoise will change as well. i move a knob on the controller, it sends a message to the plugin completely unrelated to renoise, think of it as the software’s “back door” letting information in from somewhere else. that information controls the knobs in the plugin, which simultaneously moves the fader assigned to that parameter in renoise.

all that works fine, i have gotten to the point where i can turn a knob on the kore controller and move the fader in renoise. i simply can’t (or don’t know how to) record that movement aside from using my mouse which defeats the whole purpose.

perhaps if i were to ask another question it would answer this:

if you for example have a filter on a track, and you want to manipulate the cutoff with an external knob on your midi controller, you would map that knob to the cutoff fader. no problem. but i can’t find anywhere in the documentation (maybe i’m looking in the wrong spot) how to move that knob, which would move the filter cutoff, and record that movement into the automation window. the only thing i’ve found is to right-click, and drag the fader around to record the automation in real time. if i could figure out if it is possible to record automation with a midi controller, and how it’s done, then perhaps that would help me come to some conclusion to my problem.

to anyone that wants to try it: open renoise, drop a vsti in your dsp chain. open the external editor and move a knob in the actual plugin window. you will see that when you move the knob, it will move one of the sliders in renoise (given you click on the arrow to show the sliders). i’ve already been told you can’t record automation from the plugin window, but why not? it seems like such a simple thing, it’s obviously sending the parameter information as it’s changing, wouldn’t it be easy to program renoise to simply record the numbers that are changing before your eyes?

most people don’t care about this because the normal way to do it in renoise is simple. but i’m in a situation where i basically have no option but to control from the plugin window if i want to use my kore controller.

make sense?

i’m somewhat crossing over from thread to thread here so this is partly a question on how to do something and also an “idea” that i have been posting in the other “ideas” section.

i dunno, renoise is really cool, this may just be something i will have to sacrifice in renoise, and just use my mouse. i could just use kore in my other software (cubase, ableton live), but it would be awesome if i could figure out how to do it in here, or if it were to be integrated into renoise sometime soon.

peace y’all. (haha…y’all…i’m canadian, i shouldn’t be talking like that…)

8

It tries this.

This works.

Click the little arrow in the DSP chain to show the Renoise sliders. Click CTRL-M to show midi mapping. Map a slider to the midi device with a click and a knob twist. Record.

I tried this.

Yes, you are right. It doesn’t work.

I was also under the impression you could record using the knobs (right clicked, ctrl-click, something) but this is not the case.

I would also like an explanation at this point.

PS: welcome to Renoise fellow Canadian. :)

9

ya i tried the midi mapping and had no problem recording that, as i figured would be the case (at the time of that last reply i simply had not tried that and was away from the studio, but i knew how to do it, thanks for trying it for me though).

you can see now that moving the knob in the plugin does not work, which i’ve known all along. my case just requires that function.

it seems that renoise records something else, in the case of midi mapping it records the cc changes and in the case of the mouse click it records the automation then it SENDS that info to the slider to move it where it should be.

unfortunately i need it to directly record the movement of the slider, if that makes sense.

i think i’ve come to the conclusion that i will just have to record automation without my kore controller for now, i’m just continuing this constant blabbing in an attempt to get people to realize that having the capability to record automation directly from the plugin window IS indeed a valuable function.

maybe someday this can be implemented.

thanks for your help though conner. CANADIANS UNITE. along with aaron funk we will take over the tracker world. hahahaha

10

Attaching external MIDI controllers to internal sliders won’t automatically “record” values into the automation frame, i’m sorry but you really have to confirm values by either rightclick the slider or just click the desired value in the automation frame itself. Renoise is still a preprogramming environment and not a live tool.
Though it would be nice that if “record” mode was enabled, that slider recordings are recorded, regardless of the controlling source, as well.

Furthermore in case the question comes:
There is no midi feedback to an external controller, so you will not be able to change the controller knobs on an external device by using automation from inside Renoise, though automation should change the values of the plugin attached to it on the inside.
If the device does not use MIDI messaging and does not allow you to change values from within Renoise anywhere, then there is not really much that can be done. Implementing proprietary communication protocols is not a smart move to make for any manufacturer.

11

nah Vv, the point is not the controller. like i said, i have not had problems getting the controller to move faders WITHIN renoise.

when you move a knob in a plugin window, it moves a fader in renoise. my controller does not need to communicate with renoise because it already communicates with the plugin. I can move a knob in the plugin with the controller, which then in turn moves the fader in renoise, as you all know.

i am not suggesting any kind of implementation of the kore format in renoise, but rather a standard that is found in most software these days:

take this communication that you obviously have from the plugin to renoise, and add the ability to record the fader movement in ways other than the right click move.

i don’t know much about programming, but would it be that hard to simply “capture” this fader movement?

i know this usually is not an issue, but i am in a position where i need this functionality for something else (my controller) to work.

i understand renoise is not expected to be as advanced as the other software out there that has much more money pumped into it. that is fine. i’m just saying, everyone else is doing this, and where can we go wrong by considering it for the future of renoise?

more advanced automation options is a necessity, if not now, it will be soon.

12

furthermore, for anyone that cares:

http://www.native-instruments.com/index.php?id=kore

there is a video on that page of how kore works. you don’t need to watch the whole thing, but you can see in the first minute how kore controls things in the plugin. now imagine if he had that plugin in renoise. moving through that matrix with 8 squares has 2 faders in renoise that move as well. the are called “morph x” and “morph y”. when i move using the kore controller, these faders move. when i move those faders with my mouse, it moves through the matrix in the plugin. the communication is there, all i need is the ability to record that communication. i can’t, and i understand that, but do you guys understand my problem? because if somebody could understand the problem, then i would have the SLIGHTEST chance of seeing implementation of this concept in the future. again i say, i do not need kore implementation, simply the ability to record plugin movement from the plugin.

peace friends

13

I made a mistake yesterday, sorry, now for the correct answer:
Does this look like a workable answer?