In messing around with my first tracks, I’m missing what other sequencers call ‘rechannelizing’ input sources (MIDI). IOW, if chosen, the track determines the MIDI channel notes are recorded with, not the device MIDI setting of the controller. This way, even if my controller is putting out notes on ch10, the track will ‘rechannelize’ the input to, say, ch2, when I choose Track 2 or ch4 when I choose Track 4. This prevents sample instruments assigned to different tracks from being triggered from the same controller. As it stands, I’d have to remap my samples in relation to all other sample instruments…and that can’t be right.
I do feel silly asking such a basic question but…I’ve been digging around for about 30mins and the thing escapes me.
In practice, I’ve found that the ascii keyboard DOES (at least apparently, if not actually) work this way (ie the chosen sample instrument determines what samples are being played) whereas using my controller different instruments are triggered simultaneously.
Oh, and I am using the MIDI Input box, but that seems to just assign a controller to an instrument/track rather than ‘channelize’ a controller to a desired channel for an instrument. Or maybe with RN I DO have to change MIDI channels on the device-side?
OK, so I’ve continued messin around and it appears theres a strict relationship between controller device MIDI channel setting and instrument MIDI channel being recorded. Together with some judicious keyzone mapping, I can see how to set up a multichannel MIDI project. What really surprised me was when I had 3 sample instruments, each keyzoned to match a padKontrol scene, with MIDI Input assigning each to a respective track (1-3)…but all using the same MIDI channel (ch10). When recording, this created 3 sets of notes, one for each channel. Or, if MIDI Input is assigned to ‘Current’, only the selected track would be used, but with 3 sets of notes (ostensibly for chorded/layered/grouped instruments). It makes sense I suppose.
Its not necessarily a bad thing, not being able to ‘rechannelize’ but it still feels like an odd omission, if it is that? Or am I missing something? Basically, it means I have to dial in my desired MIDI channel from the controller-side rather than being able to assign it from within software (ie Renoise)
Renoise focuses on the cursor position for note recording the current selected instrument in the selected track by default. This is regardless whether you use the computer keyboard or a midi keyboard.
You can lock an instrument to a specific track by midi setting the midi channel and track in the midi-in properties, but this instrument (and any additional selected on the same channel) will then always be controlled when recording with midi.
If you are not using more than 16 instruments, the latter works fine. If you cross the 16 instrument boundary, than midi channel assignment gets cumbersome and these last situations are pretty standard, hence by default the instrument that is currently selected will be the one that you control and the track your cursor is in, will be the track that the instrument will be recorded into.
Yes, I eventually discovered that. I’d gotten turned around earlier because I neglected to restrict keyzones to prevent zone overlap between 2 instruments.
By “midi-in properties” do you mean the MIDI Input module of the Instrument Settings tab? If so, that’s how I was able to get things to work, in a fashion. But only by resetting my controller MIDI out for each instrument I wanted to play, rather than finding out how to get Renoise to ‘rechannelize’ the source input to a desired recording input. In other words, it seems that RN’s MIDI Input module is passive, it just listens for a MIDI input and assigns that channel for recording on that instrument, rather than having the option to do something with the MIDI input before its recorded. Logic (and SVP before that) abstracts the channel input, so that assigns can be made, and rechanneled if necessary, within the DAW rather than changing the hardware setting on the controller. Unless I’m missing something in RN where this can be done?
If looked at from the sample instrument pov, I guess I’m surprised that while I can assign a controller to an instrument, the instruments themselves can’t have their MIDI channels set independently from the MIDI channel the controller is sending on.
Hence my surprise that I didn’t seem to be able to channelize a given MIDI input. I, too, wondered about what happens after 16 channels. Not sure what you mean by “last situations”, but as long as I change the hardware device (controller) MIDI channel, everything else makes sense.
The attachment shows the results of 3 recording passes using 3 different instruments, each set to channel ‘Any’ and assigned to ‘Current’ track. using a controller set to 3 zones with each zone on a different MIDI channel. Each track ends up having 3 copies of the same note. The only way to prevent that seems to be by manually matching the MIDI Input channel with the hardware device MIDI output channel. And if that’s the case, that’s fine.
I just want to be sure this is the way things are supposed to work.
No wonder, if you are new to trackers (?). Basically, there is no strict enforcement between tracks and instruments.
However, we have a little discussion going about how to associate tracks with instruments (located here), and I think your questions are very valid in that context.
Basically, my idea is to assign a name for the track if (and only if) you want to have a hard link between the track & instrument.
I think this sort of functionality could be achieved with a script - including the routing of MIDI notes into specific tracks.
Thanks to both you, and vV earlier, for your responses! Indeed I am new to trackers, having been weaned on Studiovision and a bit of Logic (but I’m here, with RN, because Logic never sat right with me…it forever promises to be an amazing tool, but just like a horizon that never seems to get nearer, the learning curve never seemed to plateau to something that made it fun). And by sheer accident, I stumbled on RN, and after much viewing and reading of forums, manuals, and tutorial videos, it spoke to me like my old beloved Studiovision did, my most recent experiences notwithstanding! I guess I’m still going to discover some of the finer distinctions between trackers and traditional DAWs, but that’s OK.
and
These two quotes from the discussion you linked, danoise, made me feel better, like I wasn’t losing my marbles (or memory) on the issue of MIDI inputs and track assigns. In fact, its not THAT big a deal for me either way. As an RN-newbie, I was more interested in finding out whether I was missing some detail about assignments, rather than wishing it were one way or another (see? I’m flexible:)) And in the bargain, I’ve now discovered an undocumented detail about Duplex, thanks to that thread! (Once I’m clear on the basics of assignments and recording RN-style, Duplex appears to be where I’m headed with my desired workflow and controller setup)
You perhaps may want to try the Midi management tool for swapping your instruments.
The solo and chain buttons are even midi mappable for as far as i remember. But the tool gives you a better birds eye view of which instrument you have connected to which device and track.
(besides that, the multi-track option also allows you to easy edit multiple notes from within one track if you have chained multiple instruments and recorded to multiple tracks)
Thanks for this! In reading the (danoise linked) discussion about single or multiple instruments per track, I have to say I’m rather agnostic about the issue. Different situations call for different approaches. Sometimes I want each instrument on a different track, other times I want to get that bird’s eye view (usually for specific arrangements within the context of multiple instruments)…at least that was the case when I had a piano-roll view of MIDI. So it remains to be seen if that changes with RN over the long run. In any case, this MMC looks to be something that could prove really useful with respect to managing inputs and assigns. Much appreciated!
I guess I’m still going to discover some of the finer distinctions between trackers and traditional DAWs, but that’s OK.