I’d like to have a Return Device in Renoise, returning the Signal from a specific Send channel and adding it to the track stream. The device could just look like the Send DSP, only with a signal flow from Send track to the track containing the device.
Let’s say I have a drum setup, containing several seperate tracks for kick, snare and so on, well organized in a group. From within the group I send several tracks to Send channels for reverb, for example. If I’m now going to process the whole group with Compressor, Maximizer, etc. and want to include the FX I used, I’d have to send the Group OUT to another Send channel, also send the FX channel to it and then do my processing. Beside the fact that this makes the Group OUT look like nonsense, it’s not only annoying. It also usually ends up in a totally confusing and weird channel setup and I’m sure most people here have been there a lot of times.
With a Return device I’d simply have to drop the DSP into the DSP chain of my group OUT and could do the whole processing within the group, saving performance, keeping things together and making things way easier and more transparent.
All there’d be to do, is to prevent endless loops. Just like the Send device does.
This most simple device IMO would be a HUGE step forward in usability.
But then I’d have to apply the FX to all tracks of the (sub)group and even with the same amount of FX to all tracks. That’s something completely different and wouldn’t work in the example I described. Not even for a single Reverb as Send FX, that receives different amounts of sent signals. The less on more send channels in free combination.
As I described, the DSPs used on ALL tracks (to be more prcise: on the summary, like Compressor, Maximizer, etc.) would indeed be placed on the group, after the returned signal was added. So, yes. I know I can add DSPs to any track. But that’s got nothing to do with the sense and use of Send tracks. And it simply doesn’t bring the same result.
It doesn’t give you the option to set Wet/Dry balance and it does force you to order your tracks in a particular way but it’s still an improvement. I think I can see how your Return To Group device may help things be tidier to work with
Why not just allow sends to be placed into groups at the most right position? If those sends could only receive input tracks within this group, it wouldn’t even break the left to right processing stream limitation.
Exactly because of the same reason. Sends in groups would work for these groups only. But one of the biggest benefits of sends is, you can share them with any track. A Return device would still allow to share a Send track. You’d just have to use several Return devices for the same channel. And I guess it would be way more complicated to code group related send tracks, than adding a technically most simple Return device.
The problem with a return device is that it breaks the left to right processing of Renoise. Thus, it is probably way harder to implement this currently. My suggestion would not, but it indeed does not resolve what you want. Although I personally cannot come up with an example for when your case is needed.
Well, the left to right restriction is a Renoise internal thing. And since the Return device would do a check for endless loops, it wouldn’t really break this restriction. It’s more like a final out than a loop. AND the restriction doesn’t change the fact each and every hardware mixer and console works with returns for send channels. Every sound engineer would laugh his ass off about a console with no returns for sends.
I’ve already told a most simple example. Just use a hall reverb for several tracks, like a piano using it in the beginning of the track and a lead sound in the middle of the track, and your’re there. Sharing the same device is pretty common and anything but special. It’s one of the biggest benefits of a send channel.