sounds much better! you are on the right tack!
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@ffx new version too bass heavy, right? mid clarity would have improved the mix instead of going for the alluring smiley-curve hype. Just my guess. Sounds cool in headphones and all, but…
PS. ffx is always complaining about my bass so I’m curious about his assessment on this 
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At 1:00 and 1:25, that short last chord, some note seems wrong to me, harmonically. New version sounds better to me, but lacks of brightness now?
If you mean TNT’s version, no, bass sounds alright to me. Maybe it is too much sustained, and should be stopped a bit earlier before the next bass note (and then a bit more release maybe). Sustained !== groovy. Also check if it is really monophonic and not overlapping.
The guitar chord chould have more transient?
I think perceived mudness only comes from panning and spreading so far. Sound eqing and selection seems to be right to me. But seems to be too early to care for such details maybe.
As a rule of thumb, maybe, decide, if the bright sounds should be mono or more the bassy stuff. Here, the bass seems to be wide already, so maybe make it even more wide using a multiband above 400hz spread/chorus/whatever, and then make each sound more narrow the brighter it sounds. bright guitar leads should not be spread at all, instead panned a bit from the center. You could nicely spread the guitar chord, if your synth allows panning per note.
What sounds really nice is a middy wide carpet of sounds and then not spread bright lead sounds, slightly panned or in the middle with a bright reverb, not so wide, as contrast.
The chords starting at 0:49 seem to be too steeply lowpassed, maybe only -12dB? but maybe its my shitty 39 eur headphones.
Once your song is completed, maybe give it a final touch by add new eq instances where neccessary, with very very flat highpasses or lowpasses, like tilts, so if you listen to the song in mono (see my shortcut tool), all sounds have their own space in “y-axis” and are not covering each other anymore (only it’s desired multiple sounds merge into one).
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Nice. This has action sequence and training montage written all over it 
I like the idea of a WIP thread. That said, I wonder if it would be more efficient and constructive for anyone looking for WIP feedback to create their own thread to have a single place dedicated to the work in question. I think posts will get lost in the shuffle and probably not get all the attention they could get in a long all-in-one thread.
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yeah, perhaps a subfolder in the songs section of this forum dedicated to wips?
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A subfolder? Why not? I think a simple thread is adequate. But a subfolder would be nice, too.
That’s too basic and self-evident. Of course there are sidechains all over the place, as well as panning of instruments. 
Alphaville? I don’t think so. Their music is usually pretty soft. Big In Japan and so on, you know? 
Thanks! But there’s still some work to do. Especially the synths and the lead need more clarity and the mix needs some small adjustments in terms of volume. I’ll deal with it after finishing the composition. Who knows what will be added and how the song will develop.
Yeah, kinda. But not really bass heavy, it rather lacks clarity imho. My mixes usually don’t have the “classic” smiley-curve, there are also mids. Here’s the curve of the mix in its current state:
But I wonder what exactly you mean if you’re talking about “mid clarity”. What’s your method?
Hm, idk, there’s a long chord, but it sounds good to me and the notes are definitely right. Also the notes of the synths playing in parallel. It’s C, D# and G#. And there’s no mismatch. But you’re right about the brightness. The synths and the lead need to be “finetuned” regarding brightness. It doesn’t take much to restore clartiy, but it could be overdone pretty easily. I will post the next mix when it’s done.
As usual everything below 200 Hz is mono. And some chosen instruments are treated mid/side, and the sides of mid and high frequencies of these chosen instruments are stereo expanded. That’s common.
It’s -8 dB lowpassed. Yeah, this is one of the instruments that lack clarity. Will be fixed,
Thanks! Yeah, I want to keep this kind of feeling for the whole song. But that’s one of the difficulties I think.
Edit:
The song is driving me crazy, I’m still stuck with the composition. Currently I’m trying several things, but it’s like running in circles. To get a little further I improved the mix instead and increased clarity (or clearness).
https://soundcloud.com/tnt-ffm/wip-v3/s-0KHgq9ujF5M?si=d6882751a77849e295b5f837fabd0429&utm_source=clipboard&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=social_sharing
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I like the sound of the plucky strings in the background around 1:12 can see putting in a break there, bringing those plucks to the front, and have a nice dancy bit right there, bit sooner and groovier than the break at 2:02.
Trying to imagine this with words and sort of feel like there may not be enough room for a top line melody.
Perhaps if you thin it out some you can more easily fit something into the mix.
Just thinking aloud, it’s coming along nicely as it is.
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Yes, the break at 2:02 is just a “placeholder”. At 1:37 I originally wanted to have a lead guitar, but I think I’ll leave it as it is and maybe bring the lead guitar at 2:02. I think thinning out something as you say might not be the worst idea, but then you have to rebuild the song, too. Or maybe the song structure could be similar to this song. I mean there are 3 options. 1. Leave everything as it is and continue from 2:02, 2. change the whole build-up to also implement something new or 3. change the composition. Maybe I should wait a couple of days before I deal with it again. I just don’t want to wait too long because that’s what I already did. I started this song at the beginning of this year to test and learn a guitar VST, but I wasn’t pleased so I finished a couple of Elektro tunes in between. Then I’ve changed the whole composition and the result is what you can hear in this thread. Now I’m stuck again because I’m looking for a specific kind of atmosphere that I want to keep over the whole song. And the composition has to be simple without being bad, but straight in your face. Before I continue I should make a decision. Anyway, thanks for the input!
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Oh that’s cool thanks for starting it! Here’s a DnB tune I’ve head loads of fun working on, because I sampled myself playing hard-to-midify notes on my Medeli keyboard, but I lost energy dealing with some of the transitions so here it lies in the meantime
EDIT: okay let’s re-try with Faircamp
Even though your song disappeared within 2 days, I was able to listen to it and I think it was quite good. It just needs some more detail work on transitions, some sections in terms of composition (there were some crooked notes before the last section) and the mix. What’s your plan? To continue or to stop?
Yeah got nuked because of me messing with some distributer. Yeah I’ll definitely continue it; it’s the cleanest track I managed to scramble and I’m insanely proud of how it came so far, so I don’t wanna “waste” it (sentimentally) 
Hm, no, that is not common.
There are way better stereo widing techniques: Chorus, flanger, micro-delays, pitch detuning or even sometimes haas panning. Or use a comb filter stereo effect, like waves PS22 or similar.
Make some elements in your song much wider, using the above technqiues, in contrast to others, e.g. pad or so. I don’t say that you didn’t so far, but it seems to me that the contrast is not very good, due using side gaining. Also slight pitch modulation is king, also for contrast. Side gaining should be only used at the very end, for even more width. It is very overrated and IMHO very bad practise. I also would go back to v2. The sounds are all very sustained, maybe you could give some of them a shape, instead a rectangle/gate like shape?
Also keep in mind that side gaining usually results in more perceived brightness, but it is fake. Also a common mistake is to side gain the very highs. The mid is the frequency range where wideness is perceived the most by the human ear.
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Listening to V3 I think the intro has improved a ton. Think it could use a little ear candy still at the transition. And maybe it would have more impact if that “lost beat”, where the full big production comes in early, is silent instead.
In fact I feel so strongly about this I quickly made a mock up for you.
Now the new section feels really impactful, doesn’t it?.
Also one with a quick riser. Just to illustrate the idea, my riser game sucks.
Around 50 seconds in you get that very catchy pattern. That rocks! It’s really good. Like I’m whistling along with it every time and moving my hands in time. Good signs!!
What would happen if the drums accented that groove some more? Keep the four on the floor kick but maybe add some ghost kicks, toms or whatever that play along with that rhythm.
Around 1:40 it loses confidence and around 1:50 it just becomes a mess. What if you really thin it out at 1:40? Just keep the pulsing thing going but make everything around it more quiet & dark. Think that might give it some interesting tension.
As you mentioned the section after that is obviously a place holder.
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I’m a bit stuck with this track:
It doesn’t have a strong hook, but it is kinda nice. The mix is quite possibly a tad bright, but I might be okay with that. Then again some instruments sound a little too fragile, maybe?
Not 100% happy with the transition to the long, held notes. And that part probably could use a counter melody but I have trouble coming up with something.
Anyway, thoughts, suggestions, feedback and such are all very welcome.
I’d drop a beat in at 1:38 and continue the theme you’ve been building. You could keep what comes after as an outro, but the song could use some meat, imo. It sounds like one long intro then an outro to me rn.
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yeah, I think that intro/outro observation is spot on. I was trying to do something without a beat again, for a change. But I suspect you might be right that just needs that. Thanks!
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At least it’s common for me and for many others. It’s a known technique. But yeah, in terms of stereo the mix needs some more work. Anyway, as I said, I don’t care about the mix at this point. I just have started composing, you know? I’m at the very beginning of the whole process. From now on everything can happen.
I don’t add gain to the sides, I only widen the side signal of the high and mid frequencies. But as I said, only specific instruments are affected. Such as snare, clap, pads and some more.
I clearly prefer v3, v2 was too dull, and I’m not the only one who thought that way. You said the same. 
But I’m still not pleased so I’m still not finished yet. I’ve worked on the transients of some sounds, primarily on the “background synths”. The other instruments like the lead or the bass are not very suitable for not being sustained imo. Or do you mean to dull the tails?
That’s the goal. By widening the mids and highs become a tad clearer without getting harsh.
And personally I’v e got the impression that it creates some subtle “air”, too.
First of all, thanks for your effiort. Yes, you’re right, the transition needs to be improved. But I don’t like the gap that you’ve created. This way it sounds broken. I think I have to change the buildup. And maybe also the composition. I’ll get back to it as soon as I’m ready again.
The idea was a straight in your face track without too much playful elements. To keep the beat and bass VERY simple and to add some synths that layer each other. But yes, indeed I was also thinking of maybe to use more toms in between, not only for transitions. I just don’t want to overdo it, there are already many things happening that need to be cleared up.
Hm, at 1:40 the “sustained parts” are gone and at 1:50 the beat stops, too. What kind of “mess” do you mean? Are you referring to the frequencies of sounds, that are not perfectly aligned yet? I’m also not sure what you mean when you’re talking about the “pulsing thing”. Anyway, you’re right, currently I’m also thinking it’s a kind of “mess” in general, the sound needs more work. It’s quite ok already, but still not pleasing imo. But I’m not in the mood for making music atm, and Black Friday is always the starting point for intense work. So therefore I’m pretty sure that I won’t finish this song this year. Maybe I’ll leave it on my drive for another year, who knows?
The buildup (nothing else, only the buildup) reminds me of the buildup of this theme, I think from 0:46 you could star to build the song in a similar way. Bring some instrument layers, some subtle drums respectively percussions, a slight increase of energy just like what you’re always doing most in your songs. A great drum beat is not stringently required imo. Just something that creates a sort of rhythm.
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guess i’ll throw this in the ring. It’s close to done (needs mixing and mastering of course), but not quite. If anyone has brilliant ideas/feedback/criticisms, please share
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For the drunks
One of the worst for your ears, I have no idea how to continue. Should drink more… I have the feeling the soundcloud lowers the volume due the annoying transient mix. Does this sound different? (remove .xrns)
psydrunk.m4a.xrns (3.1 MB)
Trying to program a muted guitar sound in MSoundFactory, the filter section is really cumbersome to use though. Does this sound like a realistic muted guitar?