You like Renoise? > Motivate the developers and BUY stuff!


(trueschool) #9

I’ve heard a few rumblings on the boards here that sound like business isn’t going so great for Renoise’s devs, including this post. Should we be worried that Renoise isn’t going to survive or something? Can anyone point me to a post where the devs are expressing worry that they won’t be able to go on?


(gentleclockdivider) #10

Oh…dear.

Quick …let’s create a thread to express our concerns …


(pat) #11

I’ve heard a few rumblings on the boards here that sound like business isn’t going so great for Renoise’s devs, including this post. Should we be worried that Renoise isn’t going to survive or something? Can anyone point me to a post where the devs are expressing worry that they won’t be able to go on?

It’s pure speculation from people who don’t have access to any of the relevant information.


(Bungle) #12

It isn’t speculation, it is fact, the developers are working on something entirely different, they outright said so, get over it.

Do people round here think they should carry on updating some niche project (Renoise) and not actually work on things that will make them money.

And has Renoise stopped working or something ?

No it hasn’t and i doubt it will anytime soon.


(Heptagen) #13

It isn’t speculation, it is fact, the developers are working on something entirely different, they outright said so, get over it.

Source? And what does that mean for us renoise users? Is there a way to tell already, that e.g. Renoise 4.0 will never happen?
You got me getting all scared n shit over here… :o


(Zer0 Fly) #14

@Heptagen

Look at official status post by taktik here: https://forum.renoise.com/t/devs-on-what-you-are-currently-working-on-redux-update/47067

Seems like Renoise is currently on hold due to time shortage, but hopefully not on hold forever and will be resumed at some time.


(Heptagen) #15

Thanks, that was clear.

I also found this statement from taktik:

“We’re not intending to close down the Renoise project, but indeed the next big release is not around the corner. As mentioned before, we actually always have been working on/off Renoise…”

This calms me down a little bit.


(ffx) #16

The guy who still uses renoise 3.0 asks others to buy 3.1… He, strange.


(Zer0 Fly) #17

Oh, you say this is a silly game? like out of the 4 people who buy new licenses because of this thread, 2 won’t like them, and one might sell on discount to him - so he can finally upgrade to 3.1?

What a naughty boy then. But clever. Renoise 3.1 haz more power than 3.0.

Now go to bed.


(Heptagen) #18

Honestly I think its a damn tragedy that people are not willing to pay the ridiculous amount of 75$ for a full-sized DAW. Every time I take a look at the competition I am shocked by their prices and conditions (Bitwig: >300$, upgrades for 12 months, 170$ p.a. after that, Ableton: 350-600€, 2-3 installations per license…) yet people seem to not even flinch paying these amounts of money.

I’ve tried ableton but it doesn’t work for me though I am not what you would call a traditional trackerkid. Renoise is my home and Renoise is where my heart is. And it damn hurts to see people not giving a flying fuck about the devs.

/rant


(Zer0 Fly) #19

Yes, I aggree, renoise is brilliant and has very fair licensing. My investment in a license has been the best I’ve done in many years, didn’t hurt my wallet either - and the software just keeps me going on and on. This is the type of software you don’t use cracked until you earn money with, you rather pay for it right away when you see it suits your need, to show respect for the thing being run on & pushed ahead.

Hell, if it would help development I’d even buy a hoodie or 2. Or maybe even a thong, though I don’t know how its measures would correspond to my hat size, and the logo upside down on the back of the head wouldn’t be so cool either. Bad to hear the merchandise won’t go a single cent into buying pizza and beer for the devs though. Or into buying another dev. Or…


(abique) #20

They should switch to a model similar to a purchase model similar to bitwig studio, they’ll get constant motivation! :wink:


(ffx) #21

Ok, repeating over and over, sorry for that, but there is a problem with Renoise: It is semi-dead, in zombie stasis. So, technically outdated in some ways for some more people. Some extra buys won’t change anything, it’s up to the dev(s).

They should switch to a model similar to a purchase model similar to bitwig studio, they’ll get constant motivation! :wink:

Let’s see in 11 months if that really did work. Looks good to me so far, but curious when the machine-gun-out new features will happen.


(Zer0 Fly) #22

Renoise Dead? Rly?

1402600482_820acf6ce0.jpg


(Raul (ulneiz)) #23

It seems that over and over again, people who test Renoise, view the potential it has and what it currently offers.However, Renoise is “paralyzed” right at a rather busy time on the part of the rest of DAWs, that causes that Renoise is obsolete in a short time. S1, Ableton Live, FL Studio, Bitwig, Pro tools, Cubase, all are programs that have improved recently, at least in the last two years… Some examples:

  • Presonus Studio Onegave a very important leap with its version 3.
  • FL Studio with version 12, with a lot of changes
  • Cubase with version 9
  • Bitwig recently with version 2

Renoise changed version 3.0.1 to version 3.1 (January 2016), with some significant changes. But there seems to be something in common in the rest of DAWs:The look and the GUI, the use of colors, layers, the order and speed of handling…The use of multiple screens and high resolutions has led to drastically improve the DAWs crowd GUI. That means investing a lot of time in changing the entire GUI to gain advantages.Renoise is obsolete for this reason.While other developers are not wasting time, Taktik is investing his time in another project, leaving forgotten Renoise.This makes the situation worse.

The launch of Redux already augured a bad future situation.For Renoise there is nothing worse than investing time in other software. Already happened with Redux, and is happening in the last months.Probably, next year there will be a review of Renoise, with some patches, that have already been solved many months before. It’s a bit strange situation. What it is good to quickly solve an error if you do not release a version with corrections for clients.In the end it all comes down to time and money.

No time is invested in Renoise, result: it becomes obsolete. Renoise does not get to amass money to continue its development, result: it is obsolete.At the moment, it seems that they are happening the two things.

They should switch to a model similar to a purchase model similar to bitwig studio, they’ll get constant motivation! :wink:

That is not possible, simply because Taktik is alone as a programmer.He would need to hire at least one other full-time programmer, and Taktik would only work at Renoise, not another project.

Ok, repeating over and over, sorry for that, but there is a problem with Renoise: It is semi-dead, in zombie stasis. So, technically outdated in some ways for some more people. Some extra buys won’t change anything, it’s up to the dev(s).

Unfortunately it is true.It is only patiently waiting for Taktik to finish his other project and have his spare time for Renoise.Meanwhile, many of your regulars customers are desperate, and the fault is of Renoise, for being so good DAW and with a very great potential.I think the best thing for Taktik is to start thinking seriously about changing the GUI from scratch from Renoise. It’s a big job, but it would be the only way to maintain a tracker these days, since the current GUI is not fine on some things and a simple adaptation to higher resolutions would still drag the old GUI with its problems. 2020 is just around the cornerand with Renoise everything is going too slow. And people get older!!!

At bottom the problem is not competition, but Renoise currently has no development. It’s stopped. And that can not be.Renoise deserves more attention, because it is very worthwhile!


(Zer0 Fly) #24

Oh, Raul, so eloquently explained. Thank you. Now I don’t like renoise any more and won’t BUY any stuff to motivate the developers. Though…I would still like to buy them a bottle of rum, cheap one, so they might be better minded towards improving renoise. In the mean time you organise a crowdfund for 1 ear of living in which he will daily be harrased to implement sidechaining and hidpi into renoise. No excuse for him! He will puke and sell the project to magix, who will then feast upon the cadaver full of maggots and ill smelling juices that are sticky an…

yeah, some rum…


(Zer0 Fly) #25
  • forum software hukkup double post, but suits the lameness of the post well -

(ffx) #26

is “paralyzed” right at a rather busy time on the part of the rest of DAWs, that causes that Renoise is obsolete in a short time. !

Nah, renoise will be never obsolete - and this is no good news - because in its niche it is the only serious, almost complete daw software available. also because it is sold as tracker with daw capabilities and not a daw with tracker capabilities.

Also I don’t agree with your critics on the gui, OK high res still missing, but besides this it is a really well designed, rational, workflow improved gui. Lot of daws gui are much worse.


(Raul (ulneiz)) #27

Nah, renoise will be never obsolete - and this is no good news - because in its niche it is the only serious, almost complete daw software available. also because it is sold as tracker with daw capabilities and not a daw with tracker capabilities.

Also I don’t agree with your critics on the gui, OK high res still missing, but besides this it is a really well designed, rational, workflow improved gui. Lot of daws gui are much worse.

I’ll dig a little deeper here…

When I talk about the GUII have in mind the high resolutions of screens at all times.Renoise can have a much better GUI while retaining its look and order.The GUI is much more than what we see with our eyes.I do not want the order of things and the speed of management of Renoise to change. It would be a disaster, because it is well thought out. That does not imply that the GUI can be changed from scratch. The code.

You have a very clear example with FL Studio, jump from version 11 to 12.The look of the GUI was very similar and the order.But the entire GUI was completely rewritten to optimize it, faster and more suitable for high resolutions.Renoise has the same GUI since version 1, with the same code base. Taktik seems to only intend to adapt to high resolutions, rather than rewrite the GUI in another way to make the sea more suitable for different resolutions. The current GUI of Renoise seems designed to be used in a range that goes from the screens of 1024 x 768 to 1920 x 1080, with the static GUI, without capacity of increase. This same GUI has its code problems. Making a simple adaptation, involves dragging the problems you already have.Why not a thorough review?

Indeed, I suspect that Taktik had a dilemma here. He knows that it is better to rewrite the complete GUI, and maybe it was one of the reasons that the development did not adapt to the GUI, because it is too much work itself, and dedicate itself to something else. This is what happens when you have to do a lot of work without just getting monetary benefits.Review and reinforce the GUI code and use a big step for this software, not just a simple adaptation, by dragging the old GUI.Or adapt, or make the code well thought out for the new situation.Obviously, the second option is better, for the software.

That would mean keeping its appearance, making it more modern to the eye, and at the same time making better use of colors, layers, and also improving the order of some things.You would still drive Renoise just as fast, only that you would have a better GUI, more optimized, and maybe consume less resources.

By the way, Renoise may be obsolete. It already is.You do not need competition to stay obsolete, because you always have to go to hardware now. I am talking about graphics cards, screen resolutions, processor and RAM. Obsolete software is one that does not take advantage of the current hardware.

Personally, I have been able to try several programs in depth, among them FL Studio, which I handle fluently. I’ve tried the Bitwig 2 demo lately. I’m surprised by his similarity to Renoise.I’ve had the chance to try the latest version of S1 on a PC from a great friend of mine for a few hours. He handles it like a bullet. I’m thinking S1 v3 is better than FL Studio 12. I like S1.But it happens to me that with Renoise 3.1 is the software with faster handling for me. When composing complex things, I go like a bullet, or like two bullets. I can not do the same with other DAWs. I’m just slower. That does not mean that the Renoise GUI can be changed from scratch. I wish the same workflow, with a much better GUI.And here between improving its look, more modern, the correct use of colors, the use of layers, etc., maybe the vector use of icons and things like that…

Oh, Raul, so eloquently explained. Thank you. Now I don’t like renoise any more and won’t BUY any stuff to motivate the developers. …

If you want to motivate the developers: buy Redux, send an email to Taktik telling him that he has bought Redux, so that they improve Renoise, although Redux will not use it.

The best motivation is money. For a programmer, is that you buy your software…


(ffx) #28

? OK. Personally a simple upscaling would be good enough for me. Like in Photoshop :slight_smile: well, the FL Studio gui code seems to be impressive work, but the look is unbelievable ugly. And it has floating windows everywhere :stuck_out_tongue: