2nd favourite DAW in Linux


(anko) #21

Still convinced or did you find any drawbacks?

for me “convinced” is different to “seems cool”, :wink: but overall i think it’s a really interesting daw with a lot of unique features. found a few buglets but they’ve already released a 9.1x update that fixes most.

thing is, having learned ardour i’m quite happy using that for my non-renoise needs, plus ardour supports LV2 plugins directly without an extra host and it’s very stable and featureful and there’s no proprietary lock-in (and of course like any other daw it can host redux). on balance i think i won’t purchase waverform9 when the trial runs out, but i’ll definitely keep an interested eye on it.

@kydcut thanks for the link, tried the linux reaper early beta and it does seem to work ok, but i’m not really interested in investing a lot of effort into it until they elevate it to a more visible, offical-ish thing, plus what i said about ardour above.


(Gavin Graham) #22

Hey hey,

The vendor lock-in is a bit of a moot point. After all is Renoise open & free as in beer? No. Plus there’s export and other method of reading their filetypes since they are based on open standards anyway.

That aside, the most important thing is choosing what works for you. Like you, I keep an eye on all the different DAWs to see where they are going. My issue with Renoise (and I’ve stated its my 1st love) is that it doesn’t seem to be going anywhere! That said, its still great as it is. …It could be better (jab jab) :slight_smile:

I’m just happy that Linux has a whole bunch of premium quality tools. It’s a good time to be alive. Woo!


(anko) #23

The vendor lock-in is a bit of a moot point.

yeah, the lock-in i’m thinking of is more locking yourself in to a particular daw’s way of working but then finding it abandoned or changed to a subscription model or whatever. of course you can always change your way of working, but for me that can be a bit of a pita if you have a lot of old projects.

some of the other stuff i mentioned like proper LV2 support is more important, but then renoise doesn’t have that either so my bias is showing there. :badteeth:

I’m just happy that Linux has a whole bunch of premium quality tools. It’s a good time to be alive. Woo!

agree totally! :walkman: i still do one or two things back in windows from time to time, but then i tend to export stems and get them back in renoise or ardour on linux.


(Gavin Graham) #24

i still do one or two things back in windows from time to time,

My condolences. hehe!

Actually, the type of lock-in you speak of extends beyond the app level of things. I have to use Windows in very very rare occasions and since I’ve been using Linux for ~20 years, I’m completely lost! I fumble through.


(anko) #25

Mu condolences. hehe!

Actually, the type of lock-in you speak of extends beyond the app level of things. I have to use Windows in very very rare occasions and since I’ve been using Linux for ~20 years, I’m completely lost! I fumble through.

haha. i keep windows around for some games, some commercial synths and other music stuff, and, being (mostly) a software developer, some testing of software on windows, although this last i can mostly take care of in a virtual machine these days.

also on linux > 20 years, since pre 1, ouch, poor old fart is i. :wink: guess this gettin a bit off topic though. have a good one.


(anko) #26

back on topic, as for this:

I made some tests with Ardour, but I don’t need its complexity and it confuses me.

i agree completely with what Gavin said above, use whatever works for you, whatever clicks with you.

ardour is super full-featured and can be a bit daunting, but you could always take a look at

http://community.ardour.org/community#videos

a pretty good intro video series if video tutorials work for you. plus there’s a lot of other stuff on youtube. if you have pro audio set up properly on linux using jack etc. then you should be able to get a handle on it for basics pretty quick. again though, the bottom line is use what you LIKE and have fun with music. imho. :wink:


(anko) #27

@lilith , in case yr still interested in waveform i’ll give you my final upshot on this. :wink:

i had a day off so i pulled an all-nighter playing around in depth with the version 9.1.x update, and i ended up fully drinking the kool-aid having a great time using it. :slight_smile: so i took my own advice and since it is really fun to use i bought a licence. if you work with samples a-la renoise their new multisampler is great and a nice compliment to redux if you have that.

overall i think it’s a well designed daw that’s a pleasure to use and has some great unique features, so fwiw i’d add myself to the list of those above who said try the version 9.x demo when you have a chance.

btw if your problem is being on an old version of k/ubuntu due to it being what kxstudio is based on, well falktx is working on the new version of kxstudio right now for release in the near future, and it will be based on either kubuntu 18.04 (an lts release coming out soon) or kde neon (which is currently based on ubuntu 16.04 but will also move to 18.04 after it’s out). so either way if you are on kxstudio and plan to upgrade you should be fine to run waveform9 in not too long. :walkman:


(Gavin Graham) #28

@lilith , in case yr still interested in waveform i’ll give you my final upshot on this. :wink:

i had a day off so i pulled an all-nighter playing around in depth with the version 9.1.x update, and i ended up fully drinking the kool-aid having a great time using it. :slight_smile: so i took my own advice and since it is really fun to use i bought a licence. if you work with samples a-la renoise their new multisampler is great and a nice compliment to redux if you have that.

overall i think it’s a well designed daw that’s a pleasure to use and has some great unique features, so fwiw i’d add myself to the list of those above who said try the version 9.x demo when you have a chance.

btw if your problem is being on an old version of k/ubuntu due to it being what kxstudio is based on, well falktx is working on the new version of kxstudio right now for release in the near future, and it will be based on either kubuntu 18.04 (an lts release coming out soon) or kde neon (which is currently based on ubuntu 16.04 but will also move to 18.04 after it’s out). so either way if you are on kxstudio and plan to upgrade you should be fine to run waveform9 in not too long. :walkman:

I couldn’t agree more. Waveform 9 is a big leap forward, imho. Hey have you been tracking this guys in-depth review?http://admiralbumblebee.com/music/2018/02/28/30-days-with-Tracktion-Waveform-9.html

Very comprehensive.

There is those with their head in the sand around here. This is a excerpt from his conclusion where he mentions Renoise:

What I_will_cease using isRenoise. Renoise has been my primary personal creation platform for many years. Development has stalled, and there’s a frustrating lack of certain features that ruin the creative process for me. I’ve outgrown it, and I’ve needed something new for a while.I tried Bitwig for this purposeand it didn’t work out for me. I also tried to do my personal experimental projects inDigital Performerand that was a disaster to me.

This is how I feel. It’s a shame, really. I do love my Renoise but its just not cutting it anymore. Still, via Redux, Renoise will live on in Waveform 9 for me.


(GUEST:::El°HYM) #29

Since iTs About #linux;

Why no one mentioned

LMMS yet?https://lmms.io


(Gavin Graham) #30

Since iTs About #linux;

Why no one mentioned

LMMS yet?https://lmms.io

I looked at it late last year and for me personally, it wasn’t a good fit. I liked some on its built-in instruments but the UI and workflow smacks of being designed by engineers rather than musicians. I don’t know exactly how else to put it. It’s childed window approach was off-putting and it just didn’t feel intuitive. Again,it’s the whole use what works for you kinda thing. If I had to do things on a $0 budget, I’d ben more inclined to got for Ardour.


(lilith) #31

Hi guys,

thanks for all the comments so far. I was playing around with Ardour, Reaper, Qtractor and Tracktion the last days and here are my thoughts…

Ardour:

As I said the handling is not intuitive for me. Sometimes I even have problems when I want to move a clip. I don’t know, but I just don’t get it and I will try harder :huh:. Also it crashes quite often. Loading takes long … etc.

Tracktion:

Also very unstable and it crashes VERY often. When the song is playing and I move clips, etc. in the window it glitches and somehow I miss the mixer (ok waverform has it … ))

Reaper (native)

unstable, crashes hangs, etc…

Qtractor:

Most stable one imo and loads super fast… Reads ALL plugins out of the box. Very logical and clean looking interface, I get something done fast and effective. Midi editor is super easy and you even can restrict notes to scales (this is not implemented in ardour). Good mixer and routing capabilities … Often updated and good support … That’s my favourite. It’s limited in function but therefore it seems to be more stable.


(GUEST:::El°HYM) #32

Good 2 know before installing & always neat 2 get sum first hand experiences from a fellow renoise user. My Budget is 68 euro, so All is Fine! :ph34r:

I looked at it late last year and for me personally, it wasn’t a good fit. I liked some on its built-in instruments but the UI and workflow smacks of being designed by engineers rather than musicians. I don’t know exactly how else to put it. It’s childed window approach was off-putting and it just didn’t feel intuitive. Again,it’s the whole use what works for you kinda thing. If I had to do things on a $0 budget, I’d ben more inclined to got for Ardour.


(Gavin Graham) #33

Hi guys,

thanks for all the comments so far. I was playing around with Ardour, Reaper, Qtractor and Tracktion the last days and here are my thoughts…

Ardour:

As I said the handling is not intuitive for me. Sometimes I even have problems when I want to move a clip. I don’t know, but I just don’t get it and I will try harder :huh:. Also it crashes quite often. Loading takes long … etc.

Tracktion:

Also very unstable and it crashes VERY often. When the song is playing and I move clips, etc. in the window it glitches and somehow I miss the mixer (ok waverform has it … ))

Reaper (native)

unstable, crashes hangs, etc…

Qtractor:

Most stable one imo and loads super fast… Reads ALL plugins out of the box. Very logical and clean looking interface, I get something done fast and effective. Midi editor is super easy and you even can restrict notes to scales (this is not implemented in ardour). Good mixer and routing capabilities … Often updated and good support … That’s my favourite. It’s limited in function but therefore it seems to be more stable.

Yet for me none of these apps crash so I wonder whats going on with your system… The only one that DOESN’T crash for you is QTractor. You’re on Ubuntu 14.04 right? That’s very old now. I wonder if it may be playing a part in it somehow.

Think about it, 75% of the apps you mention crash. What’s the common denominator? Your operating system.

I mention this as it’s hard to make a fair assessment of these apps if the root cause is the underpinning OS.

Just sayin’

Cheers,

Gavin


(Meef Chaloin) #34

Same here, no crashing with any of them. I also wonder which version of those you tried.


(lilith) #35

Can be a reason, but all other programms are running stable. Of course it can be a problem with the plugins. Especially the new zynaddsubfx (with the modern gui) seems to make problems.

Ardour 5.8.0

QTraction:Latest version from April 2018

Reaper: 5.79pre8

Tracktion 7

Same here, no crashing with any of them. I also wonder which version of those you tried.


(Gavin Graham) #36

Can be a reason, but all other programms are running stable. Of course it can be a problem with the plugins. Especially the new zynaddsubfx (with the modern gui) seems to make problems.

Ardour 5.8.0

QTraction:Latest version from April 2018

Reaper: 5.79pre8

Tracktion 7

Yeah but it depends on where these ‘all other programs’ come from. For instance, all the other programs (and maybe even qtractor), where they installed from the software centre or as downloads from other sites.

This is important as software in the software centre will be built to use the exact library files that your OS supports. And therefore, like to be older versions of the software.

Newer software that hasn’t been compiled against the exact version of OS library files may work but API/ABI changes may render them unstable.

Basically, newer software expects a newer OS with newer libraries.

Gav


(lilith) #37

Oh … just discovered that I actually have Ardour 5.12 installed.

https://ardour.org/requirements.html

Should work, or?

I downloaded the ardour file from here

and it works without crashes… may there was a problem with the older ardour version which I deleted.


(anko) #38

Hi guys,

thanks for all the comments so far. I was playing around with Ardour, Reaper, Qtractor and Tracktion the last days and here are my thoughts…

Ardour:
As I said the handling is not intuitive for me. Sometimes I even have problems when I want to move a clip. I don’t know, but I just don’t get it and I will try harder :huh:. Also it crashes quite often. Loading takes long … etc.

Tracktion:
Also very unstable and it crashes VERY often. When the song is playing and I move clips, etc. in the window it glitches and somehow I miss the mixer (ok waverform has it … ))

Reaper (native)
unstable, crashes hangs, etc…

Qtractor:
Most stable one imo and loads super fast… Reads ALL plugins out of the box. Very logical and clean looking interface, I get something done fast and effective. Midi editor is super easy and you even can restrict notes to scales (this is not implemented in ardour). Good mixer and routing capabilities … Often updated and good support … That’s my favourite. It’s limited in function but therefore it seems to be more stable.

hey. here’s my 2 cents worth on this, as always everything i say is only imho and experience.

Ardour: rock solid here on multiple different linux distro installs, and has been for years. on the topic of ardour, if you can sort out the general instability problems you seem to be having, did you try the video tutorials i linked you?

Tracktion: i think you mentioned you were stuck on earlier version? T6 / T7 were known to have stability issues. waveform 9 has also been rock solid for me on several tested linux distros. it also has MANY workflow and feature improvements. the lowest licence cost is around the same as renoise.

Reaper (native): also tested on multiple distro’s very solid, no crashes. i’ll just like it more when they make it a bit more “official”.

Qtractor: Fun, also solid, a bit limited.

gotta agree with Gavin re yr system, if so much of this stuff is crashy for you you may have software / os or hardware issues. anyway, have fun with yr search. hope you find a 2nd linux daw you like and can use. :wink:


(anko) #39


and it works without crashes… may there was a problem with the older ardour version which I deleted.

just noticed this, glad you got it working, was very surprised to hear you had a problem with this, renowned for being rock solid.

i think you mentionned you are a kxstudio user? if so, maybe when the new release of that comes out you could try a fresh intall to a new partition of that, as a possible way to solve your stability issues with software that most are finding stable?

just a thought. have a good one.


(lilith) #40

I talked to Rui concerning the qtractor crashes and it seems that Calf plugins (especially the analyzer) is responsible for it. Also there are problems with HELM. I try to built qtractor by myself and try to figure out what´s wrong. However, I´m not the only one with problems.

Ardour also crashed yestrerday playing around with the red zeppelin multiple drum kit and routing all channels to separate tracks. I´ll wait for the new KXStudio release.