Just tossing out a copy/paste snippet and say would this make Renoise less a tracker is not serious, we have discussed these things before and we are all open to new features that makes sense.
no hex numbers: Could be an idea for a simplified pattern editor
pure plugin-based architecture: What is this, we have plugins?
inlined automation envelopes: Discussed several times before, use search
smart automations: What is this?
zoomable patterns: Discussed several times before, use search
a simple pattern/orderlist layout: We have that
The point here is not about the functionalities per se, it’s about breaking the barriers for new users. I’m not comparing ZyTrax with Renoise. ZyTrax is just an example of someone trying to make trackers more accessible.
Maybe, just maybe, it’s OK for some tools to be specialised and need some time investment in order to master. Look at the Elektron Octatrack, legendary for its difficulty in learning and yet widely admired and also significantly capable.
If you want a low barrier to entry, try a subscription to Reason Plus or Studio One via Presonus Sphere, figure out your needs and wants, then, if you still think Renoise is for you then come back and learn the specifics you need.
Not everything should be immediately accessible, I’m sorry but it’s true. Maybe ring Gibson guitars and ask for an automated chords mode because learning and practise is too hard? It isn’t gatekeeping just you need to INVEST TIME and ASK QUESTIONS instead of suggesting changes from a position of little to no experience.
This thread somehow got me to remove all FX columns in my song template.
Most effects I use can be set in the volume column anyway and it’s not a big deal to add one when needed.
Since the FX column takes up quite a bit of space I now have nice narrow columns and a larger overview, I think this will work nicely.
This thread is a confusing blend of good-will, vitriol, and piano roll discussions…
After a week with Renoise, is it time to say goodbye?
No…no it’s not. You’ll need to put more time into it to truly assess and access Renoise. A week might get something ‘musical’, but there is so much going on - tracker basics aside - that you’ll be spending a week on phrases alone. If it intrigues you still, then stick at it, you’ll be rewarded. If not and you want a quick win results (as you are beginning) then pick up another DAW for a while. Garageband or what @BriocheBaps suggests - why not? Then maybe circle back to Renoise after some time, with the knowledge you’ve picked up, as it’s transferable.
Not sure what the relevance of Renoise marketing was on whether you should stick at it, a subtle work phishing attempt perhaps? hahaha
But hopefully this is helpful advice, synonymous with the friendly & helpful reputation of this forum Good luck!
You know nothing about Renoise. You know nothing about marketing. Renoise has a target market. A target market cannot be for everybody.
The first rule of marketing is: define your customer. Your customer cannot be everybody.
You will never have a product that, “does everything for everybody.” You cannot make, “a mattress that is also a sports car, or a multifamily building that converts to an airplane.” As silly as those analogies sound, that is just the plain truth of the universe.
Renoise has, its own microeconomics that you do not understand. It is a niche in the music software land. It is an anomaly, because its users are far more sophisticated in terms of their knowledge and abilities than the vast majority of hobbyists on FL Studio and Ableton.
That’s not to put hobbyists down or anything. But since you’re not a computer software engineer, somebody should tell you that some ridiculous percentage of Renoise users are software engineers and techies.
For example, “how marketing works,” define your customer 101. Who is a Renoise user? Basic demographics: ABC
For more info on how a customer is defined by demographics enter any USA Zip code into Claritas and see how they are pulled
That’s not how it works at all. So many fallacies in your text… Some products target one specific type of user. Others have a broader market.
Having an interest in Renoise and tracking is criteria enough to be considered a valued potential user. The fact that someone installed and tried to use the software means that someone has passed a huge hurdle that many people won’t. I don’t know about the stats in this case, but I would imagine that there are some product changes that are rational to make in order to increase the probability of these people becoming permanent users.
A good example of a tracker where bad UX/UI unnecessarily scares potential users off is goattracker.
Goattracker is certainly a worst case example of how a mainstream tracker should work, you have to be invested in the c64 community for it to make sense learning … but I had fun make a few tunes with it
What are beginners unhappy about with Renoise beside Hex, what is the second worst thing they struggle with?
Imagine tying instruments to columns by for example selecting the instrument in the column header then you’d get rid of all instrument numbers in the editor and then also collapse the FX column by default, these together would clean up the interface tremendously making it less overwhelming for beginners who are then just faced with inputting notes and it’s volume column.
This thread made me think. I quit this forum and Renoise too. Bye. I will remember these cool years, cool musics, cool videos, cool people, cool memes, cool endless debates about upcoming versions and new essential features that (perhaps) will never come (but who knows). I don’t delete anything or remove my account. I just stop here my adventure around soundtrackers. Of course I will miss the yearly MBC. But anyway. Bye again. Have fun! Cheers!
Everything that Renoise and the Renoise community already is, is why I and presumably many others have taken Renoise up and invested time to learn / adapt / grow into the design.
Any feedback and criticism is always good because it sparks discussion about all the shite that’s been discussed in this thread thus far.
I think it’s important to remember there are always lots of other options depending on context though. Like for example even though I use Renoise on Linux exclusively these days, I still have the odd use for Reaper and will keep renewing my Reaper licence. Likewise I have a Reason 11 licence and billions of Rack Extensions / VSTs that are all still installed on my Windows machine that I haven’t fired up in like 18 months or something but it’s there for the future in case I ever want to go back to that.
Point is though - as needs change and software develops, there are lots of other options for us musicians and surely I’m not the only one who will just use what is best for the job in whatever context said job exists. Just so happens however that Renoise is all I want and need, at least until further notice.