Automating Loop Points?

There’s something that I really think could help doing crazy things with samples, and it is to be able to draw / automate their loop points.

I am not sure this can be done right now … I have been looking and messing with all the meta* devices that allow for automation and modulation and whatnot, but I have failed at finding any that lets me change on the fly the start and end points for a sample.

I know it is relatively ‘complicated’ and non-obvious – i.e. if you select a destination instrument and it’s got more than one sample you should select the sample you’re going to alter with that device, I guess.

But it would allow for some funny/crazy micro music stuff, I think.

An example of how it would sound: just load a sample, set it to loop forwards (or ping pong, forwards gets brighter results) and play a random key… then just move the end/start points at your will. The closest they are the wicked sounds you get. Granted, you can then stay with the final result, but the fun is in being able to change that dynamically, and possibly several times during the song.

I have also tried recording this and looking for some hidden pattern effects but they are pattern effects… not sample/instrument effects and I can’t find anything relating to this.

Now just go and tell me that’s already implemented … and make me happy by telling me how to get that result!!

yeah…that would be a nice feature !!! :w00t: :w00t: :dribble:

I suggested this very thing quite a while ago. I do hope that it is eventually added. If not, I suppose that the effect can be achieved by other means.

this cannot be done as of version 2.5.

however, I have made a LUA script which allowed to move the loop points of the currently selected sample using MIDI controllers, and it worked quite well, so this should be feasible in Renoise 2.6

“Currently selected” is the keyword.
We would then also need a midi control that allows to select the sample that needs the triggering and then slots to store the loop-positions in.
To get it automated, one would then need to loop back midi information send by a MIDI control device back through a virtual midi device.
Yet how fast will this be (how much delay is involved with this?)

yes, my scripting solution was intended for live usage because of the selected sample only limitation.

actually, the script could of course modify any sample’s loop points, given that the user tells in the script code which one to control, but for non live usage this would still not straightforward to use

 Been wanting this feature since Protracker days, where you could produce cool sounds by setting the loop size and manually moving the loop start point in the sample editor. Being able to automate this as part of a song would fulfil a lifelong dream! OK, maybe not, but it would still be astoundingly cool. 

Hybrid used this in their remix of BT’s “Never Gonna Come Back Down”, for example (for those who can’t imagine a good use for this feature). Would allow for some cool effects.

Automating looppoints was one of the first suggestion topics I made years ago :) and have seen it return many times. Great to hear it is possible somewhat through a script in 2.6!

What I wonder is how the scrolling actually sounds? I’ve always imagined it would glitch a lot. Also, would it be possible to scroll through snap settings (128th, 64th, 32nd etc)? That would be great for synced beats, creating syncopation on the fly.

Yeah this is something i have wanted for a while too. +1 from me :D

well, it does glitch :)

this is feasible. if I remember well, I have also tested it for scrolling through quarters of sample length.

this whole scripting thing will be amazing

i dont know jack about scripting,is there some kind of tutorial for audio work with LUA?

I think that if there is a linear/curve envelope, renoise’s engine interpolates between every sub-row sample that it produces, so it would produce a ‘smooth’ sound between two points in the envelope, unless the automation is done via discrete points, which would definitely sound very ‘granular-ish’. Think of the sample points changing abruptly between rows. Not sure how would I implement it, if I was taktik… I mean, if the sample gets a new end point which has already been played, do we reset it or do we allow it to continue until the last point and then start in the next one? etc etc. I guess it depends on what is decided. Or maybe it could be a switch. Yet, I’m not taktik, so I’ll shut up in regards to this.

Re: the lua script for this… I have the feeling you guys are adding this lua thing so that we create super cool plugins and then you implement the coolest ones natively for best performance ever. Would be great :slight_smile:

Glad to hear more people would like this feature. Maybe it’s time to update the feature list in the backstage area? ;)

Yeah, this is a nice feature. My MOD/XM/S3M replayer/interactive-performance library for Processing has this, whereby any CC (or note, for that matter) can be mapped to any sample’s loop start point and loop length. I’ve used an automated Midi-CC device in Renoise to synchronise with the Processing playback and record live tweaks of this sort…fun and fairly easy to implement, though it’ll probably leave a lot of decisions up to the user. But that’s probably the most flexible way anyway.

Incidentally, in my library, adjusting the loop points of a non-looping sample enables looping, so that the feature has something to work on…otherwise it’d be pretty dull :) But I’ll have to add more switches and controls for people who don’t want that as the default.

Looking forward to seeing this sort of thing being available via the Renoise scripting engine.

This would be so great to have!

It could be also achieved by the effect column, if the developers would decide to expand the number of effect commands.

I’m quite interested in this feature.

It-Alien, would you consider releasing a tool ? I don’t think I’ve seen it in the tool section yet.

You can find the tool slightly hidden in this other thread: