Control AHDSR modulation (or any modulator) from a phrase?

[tumult]

Hi. So, with phrase scripts being super awesome in 3.5, and the general usefulness of phrases overall in reducing repetition in song data, I’m wanting to use phrases more. I’ve run into a snag with one of my normal techniques.

A common thing I want to do is control a modulation parameter in the sequence data. For example, the decay speed in an AHDSR envelope.

This is how I know to do it in Renoise:

1. Map a macro to the parameter I want to control. In this case, decay.

2. In the pattern editor, move the edit cursor to an FX cell, and then touch the macro knobs to put the FX command in. Edit it further from there.

This works great, for the most part. (It’s only monophonic control, even though the modulator is distributed polphonically, but oh well — still pretty good.)

If I want to do the same thing in a phrase…

I can’t? The command seems to do nothing in the context of a phrase.

I understand that sample FX chains can also be assigned to macros, and those are monophonic, and phrases can be triggered polyphonically. But the AHDSR and other per-voice modulators are polyphonic, so I’m not sure if I’m missing something, or if there’s really no way to control them from a phrase.

Is there any other way to do what I’m trying to do? It doesn’t have to use macros, but that’s the only way I currently know how to control modulators within the sequence data.

Thanks for any help.

[slujr]

Fx commands are the way to go within phrases. Specifically, the Exx command to offset envelope start position may be useful to you. Afaik, macro parameters are not able to interact with phrase info

[tumult]

Thanks. Yeah, I know about Exx. Unfortunately, that won’t have the same effect as adjusting the decay time, since it will start later in the envelope and the peak value (and initial slope) will be different. Also, it won’t work for controlling LFOs, other types of envelope parameters like release time, non-AHDSR envelopes, constant values (“Input”) etc.

It would be really great to be able to address the modulation stuff somehow from within phrases. Even if it were with some other kind of FX command and not using macos.

[slujr]

Yeah, agreed. More control is always welcomed.

Of course there’s quite a bit that can be done with Macro automation within the instrument fx section using key trackers and lfos to modulate macro parameters, but it’s a bit of a chore to set up if you want polyphonic behavior in your note sequencing - whether by phrase or pattern editor.

Everything has it’s limitations I suppose

[boonier]

Yeah I queried that the other day too.

Perhaps the Formula device could get some of the new (phrase) scripting goodness in the future?