Hello, My first post. Not a renoise user but NOW thinking of giving it a try once more. I guess I will have to claim my ignorance as 2 years ago I tried to demo renoise but after going through the songs included which I thought were pretty much horrible I uninstalled & forgot about renoise. I am an old fart over a half century old & was a bassist for @ 10 years in my youth & played in numerous unprofessional bands at the time. Mostly Jazz & Lounge with some Rock or Country here or there. So I sort of know something about music but new to current methods & genres. Was recommended renoise as sampling & triggering VSTi is my method I wish to use. HOWEVER…The first thing you are suggested to do after the install is open a demo song, which I did. I could stand about 20 seconds of it. Tried them all with about the same success…I then thought “Is this the only kind of music this DAW will produce?”. Removed renoise & didn’t even think about trackers until recently as I was playing with some freebies. Went on some MOD club sites to poke around…Found one that searches by genre so I downloaded a bunch of modules to listen to in Jazz, Funk, Easy Listening & some other similar. The upshot? Some of these clearly blew me away with their expert composition & readily apparent musical talent. Returning to the site to see the who & what on specific tunes I found that most of these tunes to be 10-20 years old made on Fasttracker 2 or Impulse Tracker!!! Yes, there was noise…Yes, there were abrupt endings…Yes the mixing was crude but the nature of MUSE was there with some incredibly complex arrangements. I now know that a tracker can do ANYTHING. And renoise should sound way better with superior mixing & effects.
So why aren’t there any tracks like those in the demo tunes? They should be musical & Inspirational & cover numerous genres. IT IS HARD TO SELL A DAW WHERE THE POTENTIAL CUSTOMER CANNOT STOMACH THE SOUND OF THE VERY FIRST STEPS. THE PRODUCT WILL BE JUDGED BY THE VERY FIRST IMPRESSIONS! After some poking around here I was surprised to find only a few who delve into Jazz, Fusion & similar with some good tunes here & there. It is probably clear here what the suggestion is & I am not the only one who dislikes EDM/Trap/Trance/Vocoding/Urban/Prison Punk or any of these strangely branded genres that lack life (with a rare exception here & there).
Now I will try it again, this time discounting & DELETING any demo tunes lacking muse safe in the knowledge that it can make ANY genre…Just like the old trackers.
It-alien used to make jazz kind of stuff. I remember one of his tracks were included as demo too at some point.
One of the tracks that really got me into Renoise was Ride the Lightning by Keith303.
https://soundcloud.com/keith303/ride-the-lightning
No need to bash different genres, there are different qualities in different genres that connect with different people. Although I have to say that with latest version of Renoise there is not a single demo song included that makes me go: “Wow, that is good!”
Yes, I think I downloaded that particular module but haven’t got to it yet.
Don’t know what you mean by genre bashing but some of the stuff I listened to from-
http://modarchive.org/index.php?request=view_genres
In the Jazz, Funk, Easy Listening, Soul. Fusion & Chillout columns were great. Seen nothing close to that on any of the renoise demo songs & the sad thing is the DAW should be filled with 'em. Sorry if anyone is offended by this but I have listened to alot of these present day genres out of an open mind but found alot of noise with a pulse…Some cool automation with effects but that is about it. My opinion though but also of many others as well. This seems to be a mainstay nowadays - sound mangling - processing - special effects. It’s just like movies, if it has lot’s of action, flashy lights, 3D, compositing & other visual pizazz most younger people will rate it high even though the story, plot or acting may be ridiculous. Just an observation.
“The world is filled with people just waiting to be offended by something.”
Don’t know who said that but find it viable nowadays…anyway happy new year to all & you can mafe fun of my dot dot dot.
Well, i guess it’s a good point about presets and stuff. But it is kind of like saying ‘all these songs i heard made with a fender jazzmaster sound crap!!!, sonic youth sucks, i guess jazzmaster is crap!’
well, truly, renoise is more close to a stratocaster, or not, or… i dunno how you make an opinion on something like that… but same idea…
Yes, the demosongs are certainly highly biased with respect to genre, but so is the whole Renoise community. Most people are into what I believe is called “IDM” or “Intelligent Dance Music”. I myself also don’t fancy this kind of music, and while one of the current demo songs, however, is quite musical I think (Hunz’s “Soon soon”),I agree with you that a broader choice of demo songs would be preferable, but as I said, the community seems to be that way and finding demo songs of other genres might proof difficult.
I also have the impression that one of the better songs made in Renoise (by B-complex, Keith303, Pete Philly &Perquisite) will not be made available as demosongs, because they are somewhat commercially successful and I believe that basically giving them away for free with the software will pose some problems for the labels of these artists.
OK got it…no bold text.
Thanks for the input fladd & others. Yes, I better understand now the community…just doesn’t make alot of sense on the developer side when you are trying to, in the very first steps, create an awesome impression of your DAW to a wide range of people with a wide range of tastes. Several years ago I was expecting alot from renoise until I heard the demo tunes at which point I thought trackers were only good for certain genres or ‘nintendo’ music. I see I was wrong. I feel the dev should pay people or give them freebies to make some awesome demo tunes in different genres…or have prize winning contests for best in certain genres with winners tunes to be used as demos.
I must say it seems like a bit of a shame to renoise to have great tunes composed one to two decades ago in nowadays inferior trackers & have none as demos? In defense of renoise I can attest they are certainly not alone whether tracker, sequencer, piano roll style.
Boy, you younger people have it so good nowadays. In my younger days multitrack recording was done on a cheap wollensack reel-to-reel in largely trial & error methods then transferred to cassette tape for distribution from ‘egg carton’ studios. We were thrilled if the tracks were even ‘close’ to syncro. Not nearly as many delving into it back then because it was resource hungry & time consuming.
The content of the demo tracks have been discussed in here many times, mostly with people talking about how there needs to be more bangers to attract the younger crowd. The point is, if the community doesn’t produce Renoise-native tracks of those different genres and audition them for a demo spot on the next release, then different genres aren’t going to be featured. And when was the last time some revolutionary track was released as a demo track? Even for communities with popular artists active in the DAW scene, like ill Gates for Ableton Live and SeamlessR for FL Studio they don’t often release their project files.
I think it’s also possible to bring up the topic without needlessly trashing the artists who were kind enough to contribute their tracks to the tracker, many of whom are active on these boards to help people out.
OK…I am not trashing contributing artists. I would never do that. Have I mentioned anybody? But if I dislike the demo tunes then it is my right to do so. Back in my days many did not like the music we made & critiqued it in many ways but nobody was personal about it. And that was as personal as you can get when somebody says it to your face…not through the internet. Seems like one cannot bring up a subject without someone getting raw about it.
Let me spell it different…If someone may get offended at anothers opinion of a demo song they should have never publicly released it. If being offended is a problem then keep your tunes to yourself & do not share them. I am saying this as a valid point to consider. Making music is very personal & tastes vary…so beware spreading it on the net. The net is not a good place for review as anybody can say anything with complete impunity. So I suggest anybody who is prone to be offended by a critique of one of their tunes (not them personally) is to keep them off the internet. Simple…simple. I see nobody complaining when you praise their work though…and alot of people share their work on the net just to receive praise, reverence, worship, etc. I am talking ANY kind of media.
But I also see where this thread is headed so I am signing off & will no longer be returning to it. So somebody else can take the ‘helm’ Remember that this thread was meant far more for devs…not the community.
Hello, My first post. Not a renoise user but NOW thinking of giving it a try once more. I guess I will have to claim my ignorance as 2 years ago I tried to demo renoise but after going through the songs included which I thought were pretty much horrible I uninstalled & forgot about renoise. I am an old fart over a half century old & was a bassist for @ 10 years in my youth & played in numerous unprofessional bands at the time. Mostly Jazz & Lounge with some Rock or Country here or there. So I sort of know something about music but new to current methods & genres. Was recommended renoise as sampling & triggering VSTi is my method I wish to use. HOWEVER…The first thing you are suggested to do after the install is open a demo song, which I did. I could stand about 20 seconds of it. Tried them all with about the same success…I then thought “Is this the only kind of music this DAW will produce?”. Removed renoise & didn’t even think about trackers until recently as I was playing with some freebies. Went on some MOD club sites to poke around…Found one that searches by genre so I downloaded a bunch of modules to listen to in Jazz, Funk, Easy Listening & some other similar. The upshot? Some of these clearly blew me away with their expert composition & readily apparent musical talent. Returning to the site to see the who & what on specific tunes I found that most of these tunes to be 10-20 years old made on Fasttracker 2 or Impulse Tracker!!! Yes, there was noise…Yes, there were abrupt endings…Yes the mixing was crude but the nature of MUSE was there with some incredibly complex arrangements. I now know that a tracker can do ANYTHING. And renoise should sound way better with superior mixing & effects.
So why aren’t there any tracks like those in the demo tunes? They should be musical & Inspirational & cover numerous genres. IT IS HARD TO SELL A DAW WHERE THE POTENTIAL CUSTOMER CANNOT STOMACH THE SOUND OF THE VERY FIRST STEPS. THE PRODUCT WILL BE JUDGED BY THE VERY FIRST IMPRESSIONS! After some poking around here I was surprised to find only a few who delve into Jazz, Fusion & similar with some good tunes here & there. It is probably clear here what the suggestion is & I am not the only one who dislikes EDM/Trap/Trance/Vocoding/Urban/Prison Punk or any of these strangely branded genres that lack life (with a rare exception here & there).
Now I will try it again, this time discounting & DELETING any demo tunes lacking muse safe in the knowledge that it can make ANY genre…Just like the old trackers.Judging a prrogram by it’s demo sogs is wel…silly …tastes aside
apart from that , I can understand that the demosongs aren’t your cup of thea , but …music = notes and the silence between them…the demosongs are a perfect example of how ( more complex ) arrangements are created in renoise .
how many DAWs come with a multigenre spanning selection of demo songs?
Ableton has 1, Cubase has 1 (iirc)…
I’d only buy chainsaws if presented by chuck norris in a plaid shit, with ultra whitened teeth grinning at me. That’s how real man chop some wood, not like that bad commercials aka chainsaw massacre movies…
Yeah, a music software is a music software, it’s a tool with possibilities you have to embrace and be able to use yourself to be happy with it?
Go for the renoise marketing team if you’d like better fucking marketing about something you wish to use but won’t directly earn money with, and suggest them to make a constant or periodically running kind of compo, granting free license updates for decent tunes only using renoise native devices to be included with some kind of fishy license with the renoise demo. Cheap deal, just some monkey has to listen to all that shit in order to decide for you what’s decent, and what’s too cheesy. I hope for you that monkey likes the same kind of music you do, so you can finally be happy and sleep in peace with your “renoise identity”.
On a slightly more positive note than some other posters (although I fully appreciate a certain degree of frustration and opinionated ranting - it’s what we all do best):
I recently posted a song which may be a little different from the usual run. I hope the original poster likes it.
I do not like IDM that much, although it does have good things here and there. Depends on the spirit, on the mood.
I haven’t listened much to the demo songs. The ones I heard I did not like.
But then, what would I do if I want to start painting ? Would I say:
“oh look at all those tubes of paint of various colors”
And then, looking at the paintings from a few painters say:
“that’s all that can be done ? Not worthed. Those tubes of colors are no good”.
Of course I wouldn’t.
So it depends on how you view creation and working with tools to create stuff.
But if I dislike the demo tunes then it is my right to do so.
That’s not important. What’s important is the tool. If such a creation tool does not bring any inspiration (at least enough to learn some of it and use in some ways) then maybe a ukélélé would be more suited. It also has four strings, just like a bass. :-)))
Or more seriously, as I’ve tried one recently and found it really and amazingly fun, a micro-bass:
http://www.microbass.com/products/microbass-25fl/
I would have never thought that strings made out of rubber, and on such a short neck instrument, would be so much fun to play.
I played it myself and had fun. I only watched the videos later. That’s the key. In that case I immediately saw and felt the potential of the instrument. Haven’t got one yet, though.
With Renoise and other apps, it needs much more exploration before ‘playing and having fun’ and there has to be some creative ‘flame’ right at the start that pushes forward to spend time to learn some of it. And it is not the demo songs that will create a true creative ‘flame’. The potential of a tool has to be assessed intuitively at the beginning.
If not, then maybe the tool is simply not the right one. No big deal. Creativity is still there, isn’t it ?
If I may add, I’m experiencing something similar with the Launchpad thing, perhaps even worse. I see that it could be useful to play and have fun, especially since I’m starting to know Renoise a bit more and have my own (guitar) samples now, but for the life of me, I cannot get any Renoise app (Lauflicht, Duplex) to work correctly. No matter which buttons I press, I cannot have the thing to behave simply like play this pattern now, then now play the other when the other button is pressed. So it is not currently tempting to fork some $150 to get an actual Launchpad interface. All the cool videos are there, but it can’t get it working 
And that’s the subject of another thread. It’s on the backburner and I’ll get back to it because I see the creative potential.