Yes for me workflow is important, because I make music because it is fun to do, not only for the result. If it is a pain, I don’t want to do it, it’s my hobby after all and not work.
And yes, programming drums in midi in Bitwig is not fun at all for me.
i simply use bitwig because it’s supported on linux. But i would like to see retro-recording like found in live ableton… that thing is hella fun, and you do not need to ‘press record’ in order to capture an idea… it’s really a pleasure to make music that way… About ableton devices - Bitwig surpasses them in almost any way… except the new convolution type of reverb which is kinda cool…
And i really do not understand statements ‘Ableton effects sound better than Bitwig’. Which one do sound better, and do you have an clear idea what is ‘wrong’ with the Bitwig ones? Since i cannot determine. Does Ableton’s eq sound better? in which manner? do you know how it’s programmed behind the curtain, so you can match the parameters? i really do not understand these claims… Bitwig devices are more than sufficient for anything, literally
Bitwig = dynamics + any device to process the signal feeding the compressor
can this be done in Ableton Live with native devices? except builtin eq in the compressor eq section?
well, if your paycheck is 500$ (or most likely below), and if your daw is 600$.
subtract the rent, the bills, the food, transportation, and you’ve on survival mode. 600$ does seem like something not even possible from that perspective. This depends on your pocket of course… but in my country, the average is less than 300$. With that, i could buy a pc with decent soundcard for a year or two, ableton for 3 years maybe, if everything stays ‘ideal’… soooo… it’s a long discussion.
And i also agree that the price is not expensive for the Ableton itself… It’s about context and conditions you’re in
this is possible by using the layer view in Bitwig i suppose
i love retro-recording in Ableton Live for this purpose. I jam on qwerty, then capture idea, edit a bit with mouse, and there you go 
no need to ‘program’ or ‘paint’, something in-between i guess
Yes, a lot of such workflow stuff is missing in Bitwig. And it was requested since a lot of years. They do not seem to care for such stuff at all. I think they very much design it by their own preference, not the customers.
I don’t like layered pianoroll editing, I think it is conceptual a mess and a poor workaround. Notes can even cover other notes, what a nonsense…
Are there at least a lot of shortcuts in layered pianoroll editing, @dspasic ?
I think a two pianorolls NEXT to each other (one on the top, one on the bottom) would make a lot more sense, and some shortcuts where you quickly switch the tracks, for each of the two pianorolls.
About the price, if Ableton is considered as a professional DAW (and I think yes it is) then it’s ok. For a hobbyist the full version it’s certainly quite expensive.
There is another point underestimated, Ableton Live is, according to me, the only DAW that have some strong marketing hype (for example I saw at least 2 or 3 art exhibitions and events in Paris related with Ableton Live, not for other DAW). An certainly this marketing have a cost, but also it’s necessary for a commercial company to stay visible so it’s nothing bad.
for those who want to use rewire:
It is disabled by default and not officially supported anymore, since Propellerheads (now Reason Studios) themselves killed Rewire’s development.
You can still enable it with options.txt and “-EnableReWire” option.
(The “Redist” folder in Live’s install folder still has the ReWire.dll file.)
