Err.... #80 Instruments Aren't Enough For Me...

Sorry if it sounds stupid, or if you think I don’t know how to track properly, but yeah, 128 instruments aren’t always enough for me.
Is there any possibility for the developers to add one little bit to the coding of an instrument number ? Would it be too annoying (the whole RNS format to change ?) ?

Thanks a lot.


Just because I cannot think of an application does not mean it’s not useful.

Would you be kind enough to let me hear your music or point me to links of music that required that type of sample arsenal? I am very curious.


makes me curious aswell…
some samples could go into splits, couldn’t they…
since every split is tunable it shouldn’t be a problem for drums etc.
it’s a bit hard to imagine running out of 16 banks*8 intruments with
16 splits per instrument… theoretically, this gives you the abillity to use
2048 different samples, doesn’t it? (i hope my math is correct there… :o )
so, I would like to hear it aswell… see a Rns, maybe, learn summat… :P

peace, (I)

on a technical side, I think that there should not be big problems in adding 128 more instrument slots, as I assume that they used a byte variable to count them, which can already contain 256 values.

What I can imagine that would overcome the 128 instruments limit is to use a lot of short samples from synths at different resonance and cutoff values, which can hardly be put on a splitted instrument because of the fact that they probably represent the same notes.

Another thing that might cause this could be the use of multilayered samples into ReNoise, without using a VSTi sampler to manage them, which another time bounces up the missing of a multilayering feature in ReNoise.

Let’s see what Jnv says us :)

Ok, well, let me tell you why I need 256 instruments, then :)

First of all, I try to compose orchestral stuff, so I need a lot of samples with different dynamics. The biggest flaw of Renoise, IMHO, is that you can’t assign several volume (for example) curves to the same sample, as you could in Modplug Tracker. So you have to copy the sample twice, or more…

Then, I never or rarely use Multi-sampled instruments, and here’s why : Even with drums & percussions, I like to have a large range of frequency for each sound, you can sometimes create some nice variations of a drum this way. This also works with realistic instruments : I use to switch between 2 differents samples to play the same note. This sounds much better, offers a wider variety of sounds.

I don’t use VSTi also (not even to read my Soundfonts), because here again you lose some controls (like the 09xx effect, critical to get a realistic/dynamic result). So I load all the notes I need…

Would you be kind enough to let me hear your music or point me to links of music that required that type of sample arsenal? I am very curious.

You can listen to the ‘Kholdan’ song on my site. Orchestral stuff, maybe you’ll like it. In this song, I felt limited at some point, but managed to make it, there’s always a way.

My argumentation is over now :)


I suggest you take a deeper look at software-samplers as Kontakt or Halion 2, with thouse you can put up multi-layered samples, you can assign automation to midi commands and much much more… if you learn the software you will see that you will have as good contol as you have with internal instruments, even if you maybe have to do things in a little different way to achive the same result, plus you will get many more features with a software-sampler than you will pobably ever get with renoise… why? because thouse programs are specialized on beeing just samplers, while renoise is more of a seqencer-software… it is a full-time job to develop a software-sampler, so the chance for renoise to catch up with the commercial software-samplers is probably very small… if you looking for realism, features and dynamics a software-sampler is today superior to renoise… just my 2 cents ;)

However, I still second you that it would be great to be able to load more instruments than is possible today, so you have an alternative if you realy do not want to, or don’t afford to use a commercial software-sampler ;)

I reckon what it all boils down to is what types of music you are making AND your approach to composing. I use samples, VSTi’s, samplers (Kontakt), midi-editing and automation aswell as manual editing in music-styles that range from the simplest electronic style to real instrumental arrangements (in my case that is live guitar, piano and strings…) and seldom run into limitations. (Although this may show on my own limitations ;))
Some tunes may use just a few instruments and 6-7 tracks whereas others may use 100 instruments/samples+VSTi’s and approach 64 tracks but Ive never, knock on wood, reached sample-slot limitations even though it would be nice to have the limit pushed further…
ofcourse there’s always people that are meaner and can carry out the tasks I find tedious with a shrug and a raised eye-brow… ;) and those are the ones Id like to learn from…

The way I see it is, where one tool can’t help you there’s another one that does the job…

I am FOR increased; resolution, number of instruments, multilayering, multitimbrallity etc.etc.
and I think Renoise is moving towards that goal. Maybe not to infinite limitlessness but close… :D

Jnv - nice work btw…


I would also really like to see 00-FF instruments in the next version of renoise. It should be quite “easy” and simple to make…?
When you make long and complex, heavily loaded songs, chances just are that you’ll run out of available slots. The work-arounds make everything more complicated.

Don’t know… but a sample-pool sounds more effective in this manner.

Twilek:With the Quantum Leap orchestra, i hardly can fill ten instruments without clogging up my memory. I can do Aliassing to save some memory but Aliassing is not worth much if i can’t use simultaneous different Renoise effects upon them. And i have a slight feeling, this will probably not be supportable, not because Taktik wouldn’t want to code it, but probably because of the limitation of VSTI plugs.

I purchased an SATA harddrive specially to do the DFD action else it’s just a nightmare loading that stuff into my 1GB ram.
I have a 3Ghz cpu and 1GB ram and i still have nothing for this kind of samplers.(1GB is really nothing when discussing multilayered instruments that are 80MB each)
So yes:Samplers are the bomb if it comes up to endless possibilities but you need good shit to process all of that.
And SATA doesn’t do it satisfactory enough either… SCSI still outperforms SATA on multiple simultaneous access requests. (Yet there is no better deal then SATA if you want to ditch IDE but don’t have that much money upon expenses)

I downloaded some songs… I’d may be said before to you, but this stuff is really brilliant! and I just had to sayd it