Is Renoise terminated?

Help, Support & Bugs
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@Finnishcoffee: thanks for making that video, it makes things so much clearer.

You’re definitely looking for “record arming”. This is a common feature in DAWs, which lets you indicate which tracks/instruments should receive MIDI input (or audio for that matter). Unfortunately, Renoise doesn’t have that as a built-in feature, so no wonder if you’re feeling a bit frustrated when looking for it.

But the scenario you’re presenting is not too uncommon, and can entirely be scripted. I think the MIDI management console (which you gave a shot) is ready for retirement, as it’s trying to achieve too many things at the same time (some of which has become possible natively with Renoise, such as the stacking of instruments).

Instead, a more focused effort would be to have this (imaginary) tool taking care of the recording arming by going through, and presenting all instruments which are tied to a MIDI input. Then, you could choose to either (1) MIDI assign the record arming directly to some button on your controller, or (2) use the velocity as an indicator. Of course, it should use the routings you’ve specified in the MIDI input panel (or even allow setting them from the tool itself).

It should probably also allow passing MIDI notes onto the currently selected instrument, when dealing with a range of the keyboard which has not been assigned to an instrument, anywhere. That would allow the usual flexibility, especially useful when trying out sounds before explicitly mapping them.

Here’s a quick sketch of what itcould look like:

midi-performer-screenshot-2.gif?raw=1

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Yep. That sounds about right… So now I just need to find someone who knows how to script for I most certainly do not. :blink:

@Finnishcoffee: thanks for making that video, it makes things so much clearer.

You’re definitely looking for “record arming”. This is a common feature in DAWs, which lets you indicate which tracks/instruments should receive MIDI input (or audio for that matter). Unfortunately, Renoise doesn’t have that as a built-in feature, so no wonder if you’re feeling a bit frustrated when looking for it.

But the scenario you’re presenting is not too uncommon, and can entirely be scripted. I think the MIDI management console (which you gave a shot) is ready for retirement, as it’s trying to achieve too many things at the same time (some of which has become possible natively with Renoise, such as the stacking of instruments).

Instead, a more focused effort would be to have this (imaginary) tool taking care of the recording arming by going through, and presenting all instruments which are tied to a MIDI input. Then, you could choose to either (1) MIDI assign the record arming directly to some button on your controller, or (2) use the velocity as an indicator. Of course, it should use the routings you’ve specified in the MIDI input panel (or even allow setting them from the tool itself).

It should probably also allow passing MIDI notes onto the currently selected instrument, when dealing with a range of the keyboard which has not been assigned to an instrument, anywhere. That would allow the usual flexibility, especially useful when trying out sounds before explicitly mapping them.

Here’s a quick sketch of what itcould look like:

midi-performer.png

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Hi Finnishcoffee and Danoise

… Unfortunately, Renoise doesn’t have that as a built-in feature, so no wonder if you’re feeling a bit frustrated when looking for it.

…

I do not know if I understood you.Here it seems to point out clearly that what Finnishcoffe wants to control is not currently possible with Renoise 3.1.0. However, in the rest of your message I do not know if you mean that it is possible to create an additional Script Tool using LUA for this specific control of the MIDI, or simply states that Renoise could support it in a future version.

I get the feeling that Finnishcoffee is waiting for a solution that does not exist (in Renoise 3.1), and that’s why you’ll have to settle for with what is currently.

@Finnishcoffe,Conceptually, Renoise 1.0 - 3.1 seems designed to work step by step on each Track.Compose one track with one instrument and then another with another instrument, even when recording live. You have the Track 01, the Mixer for Track 01, Chain DSP for Track 01, Automation Editor for Track 01, and the midi routing seems to be focused in the same way.

I recognize that his method of playing live is different from mine, but I find it interesting to solve some kind of composition.

There’s a phrase that’s been hanging around my head lately (and more according to this topic): “_Renoise is not made to satisfy the customer, the customer must learn Renoise and its capabilities…”_A double-edged phrase.

Finnishcoffee creates a theme asking whether Renoise is finished or is still developing, and whether it is worth investing in it little money, while asking for help with a matter MIDI routing.This theme, with all these comments and their participation, demonstrates what is happening again and again with Renoise. Users who want features that do not exist, and probably never exist in the future, given the slow development of the software, and in the end they pray for someone in the forum to help them.

It should be recognized. Many users are outraged because Renoise is unique.It is the only DAW type tracker on the market that is worth it AND IT MUST EVOLVE!It is very normal for people to despair, and demand, ask or beg Renoise to be improved, to infinity and beyond, that he lacks this and that.The years pass. And that does not involve developing scripting tools LUA by third parties, but features under the hood, serious things.In short, more satisfaction for the paying customer, not for satisfaction the taste of the developers, although they are in their right to do what they want.

Finnishcoffee has shown a real problem, created a video that involves work to teach it, and has stamped against a wall.Will you skip to the ignore list?

Finally, the MIDI theme, the control and the relationship between MIDI devices and Renoise is what I lack to master the complete Renoise. That is why I find all this very interesting.Too bad it also ends in the same way as usual, without a concrete solution.

Do you want to be a cat?Look!!!

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Of course DEVs will skip it as they always did :wink: Or will create it in 2022. I mean i was with Renoise about 2 years +/- (sold it, buy it) and at this period nothing changed. 2 years… For me situation is simple: If you sell it you need to listen people who gave to you money from their pockets.

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Sorry, I just have to be lame now.

Everything has been said. Why these ever revolving threads? When there should be known what is going on.

But in reality, it is just like with cats. I mean you have to respect cats, especially the grumpy tattered ones. Ones that don’t charge 500€ for their daw, but only 70 or so.

Or else…if you meddle with the affairs of cats, they might be subtle, and…

29ofiae.gif
29ofiae.gif800×600

Just to say, I kind of feel with the team. It is an experiment, a pretty cool one, and I like it.

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Sorry, I just have to be lame now.

Everything has been said. Why these ever revolving threads? When there should be known what is going on.

…

Have you read the title of this topic?As the participants talk about it, it is inevitable, although it treats two subjects in one, the second is “camouflaged”. Meanwhile, we also try to help and understand the doubts of the creator of the topic.Which may be new in the forums, but is not new to music.I just congratulate everyone who comments what they want.Even when cats are included.

Perhaps some themes are repeated because new people enter and ask questions, or because some do not read all forums constantly, and also because the forums are a bit chaotic until you do know them (despite the efforts of some). They need timely help or have questions about something, like everybody in any subject.

Personally I like these forums because there are people who are committed to improving things, doing as a pulse against passive people that in the background does not matter the development of this software to them and they only act as a handbrake…

So no, we do not always talk about the same thing the participants of the forums. Finishcoffee has problems with its MIDI routing and Danoise has clarified that Renoise 3.1 does not support such a feature.The forum is still working, at least to make things clear.

67

@ Finishcoffee. I’ve been thinking of some way to alleviate the problem of recording unwanted instruments on the tracks. Although not a solution, you can use some tool to clean tracks written “by accident” by MIDI routing.

The utility would be to select the track you want to erase, and erase it completely with just one click of the mouse, all patterns at once. Maybe it will lighten the work a little.

This summer I created my first Tool XRNX, with a lot of patience and help from some members of the forums:

[sharedmedia=core:attachments:6961]

GT16-Colors v1.1(download here)

With the utility " GTC: Groups and Tracks Control" you can select an entire track and clean it, in all patterns at once with the CLM red button. Steps:

  1. Select track with unwanted notes.
  2. Run the GT16-Colors Tool and press the red CLM button to clean.You will keep all track settings, just delete the letters and numbers in the pattern editor.

It does not have anything to do with MIDI routing, but it can be a later step to relieve the work, as with your method you will write unwanted notes.Yes, Renoise lacks some features. That’s why there are a lot of tools made by third parties. Maybe you’ll find it useful.

Everything is to speed up the work!

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Scripting in record arming should be quite simple really, use

renoise.song().selected_instrument.midi_input_properties.device_name = “”

and

renoise.song().selected_instrument.midi_input_properties.device_name = ‘Your midi device name’

Raul: the problem with cleaning here is that you loose data that you may want to keep.

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Scripting in record arming should be quite simple really, use

renoise.song().selected_instrument.midi_input_properties.device_name = “”

and

renoise.song().selected_instrument.midi_input_properties.device_name = ‘Your midi device name’

Raul: the problem with cleaning here is that you loose data that you may want to keep.

Yes,In this case, you would have to use the alphanumeric keyboard commands to select and delete, pattern by pattern, by steps.I assumed he already knew them.

I have not tried it, but if you have the track collapsed, also record the notes?

Maybe there might be some condition script, which says:

  1. If the “Track is collapsed” (CTRL + K): the consequence is not to record any live notes. Guau, practical!
  2. I believe that Finnishcaffee commented in the video than: if the track has the “Volume Bar Post” in “-Inf db” position the consequence should benot to record any live notes, but he would only have control of the first 8 tracks because in its MIDI keyboard it only has 8 faders, the rest should be controlled with the mouse.

If the first point is possible, you can assign a key of MIDI keyboard to control = CTRL + K.With the midi keyboard you could control everything as he wants.It would be a real and magnificent solution. Would not know if it’s possible to create a LUA script tool that works this way???

Already put, could also work with the 2 points, and let the user choose.I’m pretty sure if Danoise, Joule or DBlue see this, they would find a solution.For my part, I still do not have the level required with the LUA code, unfortunately, but would already be writing.Also, I do not think it would be a long code. It would work with a few lines of code.

Note : “Collapse Track” is not appear in the Midi Mapping Panel.Maybe it’s a problem.Midi Mapping does not accept functions equivalent to alphanumeric keyboard controls, such as CTRL + K?This is something that interests me, to get mapped in another way.

7061 midi-control-collapse-inf.png

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That is all so complicated, just have a mouse controllable list for arming and populate that list by marking the instruments you want in the instrument box. If you want to do it all on the controller - make the functions available to the midi binding tab, the same way you do it with keybinds, but I’d just use the mouse.

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Glad to see there are people other then myself that are still using this awesome DAW. :slight_smile:
While it indeed does seem to be a “Arm Record” for individual tracks that would solve this, I have been messing around with the MIDI controller and what actually CAN be done with “MIDI MAP”.
Like someone said earlier, it’s all about workflow. Step by step recording, one instrument at the time is OK for some, but it is definately very time consuming and does not work well with improvisational playing and a sudden urge to record on the fly.

The MIDI Controller I am using is a big help for it has a number of sliders, knobs and buttons that can all be used to control anything MIDI Mapable in ReNoise.
The maximum number of MIDI channels I can play simultaneously are 4… As for now, that means I can turn on and off MIDI to 4 separate channels and whatever VSTi are Routed to those channels.
That with the 8 first tracks volume on the sliders will have to suffice for the moment.
additional arrangements such as background orchestra, percussions and choirs or similar things, I don’t mind putting on tracks that are outside the range of my 8 sliders for now.

The M-Audio of my choice has another 8 knobs (MIDI Value 0-127) and that sit next to the sliders. These are currently used for resonance, cutoff, attack, delay, breath control and other MIDI controllable parameters.
It also has 8 buttons that can do ON / OFF controls and those are what I was going to put SOLO or MUTE on if it had worked to stop ReNoise from sending MIDI on tracks that are muted.
In the OPTIONS menu of ReNoise I found something that says

Mute Mode -> off (Don’t trigger Notes/events)

(( How do I instert a screenshot here? Forum wants me to use a URL and that didn’t work with DropBox ))

But it does not work with recording, only playback. also makes me wonder why we have to chose only one or the other way of muting instead of both, wich would make more sense.
Would also make sense if it did work while recording and not just playback.

It’s stuff like this making me wonder if ReNoise is still being worked on. The Manual for ReNoise is barely touching anything MIDI related and is not of any help.
So I appretiate the responses here on Forum from people more experienced with ReNoise then myself. :slight_smile:

I’ll have a look at that cleaning-tool at some point. It would still come in handy for when I have played and recorded several minutes of improvised music and have to remove those VSTi that were not supposed to be there at all.
I can sometimes utilize the Matrix view to wipe out blocks of notes but that don’t work when recording second time from start to end with the next group of instruments since they are then all jumbled up with eachother, notes that should be there, and notes recorded_again_ from the Routed MIDI isntruments that was supposed to be quiet that time around.

For me it’s a LOT faster to actually play in real time parts of the ensamble at the time rather then one single instrument at the time, one track after another.
That system works if I already know what I want, but not when I improvise, like what comes out, and just want to be able to hit “Record” before the flow of inspiration dissipates. :rolleyes:

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That is all so complicated, just have a mouse controllable list for arming and populate that list by marking the instruments you want in the instrument box. If you want to do it all on the controller - make the functions available to the midi binding tab, the same way you do it with keybinds, but I’d just use the mouse.

Using the mouse in the middle of a performance is not an option. I can’t stretch all the way to the mouse, move the little cursor to a small zone of the screen and klick there anywhere near as quickly as punching a button on the MIDI Controller.
There is a reason MIDI controllers were invented and that’s one of them. Mouse klicking in real time recording does not work. One reason I don’t use Studio One (DAW) is that they do have the Arm Record there, but it’s a tiny little button that can’t be maped to MIDI or even computers keyboard. You have to mouseklick it and that is simply not doable most of the time while real time playing.
I have only 2 hands, and they need to be on the piano while playing, not fumbling with the mouse and screen. :lol:

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The manual does not say a whole lot as by design, renoise is a tracker and a tracker is not a recording-centric daw, it’s a programming centric daw. A recording centric daw would be your Cubase, studio oneand the similar. Renoise has of course so much more to offer than just the tracker, but that’s a different discussion.

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The manual does not say a whole lot as by design, renoise is a tracker and a tracker is not a recording-centric daw, it’s a programming centric daw. A recording centric daw would be your Cubase and the similar. Renoise has of course so much more to offer than just the tracker, but that’s a different discussion.

True. Cubase is another one that I have tried and tested and it lacks a whole bunch of things, first and foremost the Tracker view itself.
There are another 549 reasons I will never get Cubase as well. That’s the 545 Euro on its pricetag.

ReNoise is near perfect DAW for me. I figured it wouldn’t hurt to get something started on the forum with the few things missing seeing as we actually DO buy license for future updates as well, it would be silly not to ask questions and suggest improvements.

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@Finnishcoffee.I have not tried it, but if you have the track collapsed, also record the notes?

Try to collapse the tracks when recording live, to see if it does not record the notes.I guess Renoise will expand the track when receive a note.

Can you check?

Yes, the idea is to have quick control from the midi keyboard.Perhaps with a single assigned MIDI button, would suffice.

I am experiencing again the limitations of MIDI routing.I thought you could assign a button of MIDI keyboard to a keyboard command (CTRL +?), Or something.

Let’s see if this whole talk gets anywhere with the subject of MIDI routing…

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@Finnishcoffee.I have not tried it, but if you have the track collapsed, also record the notes?

Try to collapse the tracks when recording live, to see if it does not record the notes.I guess Renoise will expand the track when receive a note.

Can you check?

Yes, the idea is to have quick control from the midi keyboard.Perhaps with a single assigned MIDI button, would suffice.

I am experiencing again the limitations of MIDI routing.I thought you could assign a button of MIDI keyboard to a keyboard command (CTRL +?), Or something.

Let’s see if this whole talk gets anywhere with the subject of MIDI routing…

I have not tried collapsing a track to see if that stops recording to it. I think that function is only a visual help though, so that we can focus on editing some tracks without the others taking up screen space.
I can actually assign real keyboard commands to my buttons on the M-Audio as well. Such a CONTROL+T for example. But that would not help the people that have MIDI Controls not capable of doing so.
An ARM Record for individual tracks that is MIDI Mapable would still be the best sollution I think.

To see exactly what can be MIDI mapable, just klick the MIDI MAP key far up to the righ corner. That will open a window in ReNoise and there you can view a scrolldown list of all the stuff that can be MIDI maped.
ReNoise allows for more MIDI Maping then most other DAW out there and it’s one of the reasons I paid for a full license to ReNoise instead of for example Studio One.
ReNoise has such a tremendous potential to beat all the other DAW’s if only a few more things were added to it.

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An ARM Record for individual tracks that is MIDI Mapable would still be the best sollution I think.

That means getting a Taktik in the middle, and now he’s busy with something other than Renoise.

To see exactly what can be MIDI mapable, just klick the MIDI MAP key far up to the righ corner. That will open a window in ReNoise and there you can view a scrolldown list of all the stuff that can be MIDI maped.

In Navigation/Sequencer/Columns,no option appears “Collapse/Expand track”.Order code is possible via LUA script (my tool owns it, GT16-Colors Tool , for example).It is also possible to route MIDI to that order through a tool with script LUA ( Voicerunner Tool support MIDI route, for example).

At this point, we only need to know the following:

  • LUA code that prevents live recording of notes on all collapsed tracks.In this way, you with a single button from your midi keyboard would control what you want.Collapses tracks that you do not want to record. Ready!This would serve all the tracks, not only the first 8.

Every time you think about a new feature or feature, it’s about thinking big, not to solve small or concrete things.

It seems reasonable to collapse the track so that she does not record any notes when recording live.Do not be just a visual aid.

The tool could be something like this:

| “LIVE MIDI CONTROL” or “LMC” X |

| |

| Do not record with collapsed track [v] [Collapse Track] |

| |

| Do not record with -Inf VOL POST [v] o- Fader VOL Post -o |

| ___________________________________________________________|

  1. [v] CheckBox , for selection functions.
  2. [Collapse Track], Button , for Collapse/Expand Track Selected. Control with MIDI route, new!
  3. o- Fader VOL Post -o, Slider , for control VOL Post Track Selected. Control with MIDI route, already exists!

It remains to be seen whether point 1 is possible!: (do not record with collapsed track and do not record with -Inf Vol Post) The tool would be very simple with 4 things…

Of course, you should have the tool running, opened in the background.This would be very fast. Navigate with the buttons on your midi keyboard by the tracks, and collapse the necessary ones with another button, to not record notes, or decrease the fader in -inf VOL Post for 8 tracks.

I hope Danoise reads this and helps.Maybe I can write the code…

Edit :With the collapsed track Renoise continues to record the notes. I checked it…

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I created a template to make an example with my MIDI KeyboardNovation | Launchkey 61:

7063 renoise-midi-mapping-novation-launchkey-61-x1500.png

It would be great if anyone shared the configuration of their MIDI keyboard.Things I have in mind:

  • Now I understand the order of the notes in the pads. He had a mess.Actually, channel 10 seems reserved for the pads.
  • InControl does not work with Renoise.It looks like a feature made for Ableton. So ignore, three buttons in the trash.
  • Pitch is fixed, does not allow mapping. Also Midi Channel Buttons and Octave Buttons.
  • Midi Channel Buttons allows 16 channels.I can assign all 8+1 sliders, all 8+1 buttons and all 8 rotary potentiometers, in each channel:
    • 8 channels and 8 sliders/buttons/rotary are 64 to control.
    • 16 channels and 8 sliders/buttons/rotary are 128 to control.
    • Now I know how to control these things.
  • Renoise allows basic functions like these (plus plenty of more advanced features):
    • Play/Stop
    • Rec
    • Advance/Rewind of the tracks in Pattern Editor.
    • Advance/Rewind of the Instruments in Instrument Box.I did not know this until now.In version 3.0.1 I do not know if it was available.
    • Play/Stop Metronome.Does not allow volume control.
    • etc…
    • etc…

7064 midi-mapping-renoise.png

So what I’m thinking, is if there is some form of MIDI routing to control alphanumeric keyboard commands, with the MIDI keyboard.This would allow me full control. For example:

  1. Collapse/Expand selected Track (CTRL + K).
  2. Add/Delete selected Track (CTRL + T, CTRL + SHIFT + T)
  3. Add/Delete selected Group (CTRL + G, CTRL + SHIFT + G)
  4. Transpose notes in Track selected???
  5. Navigate in Explorer Box, to test samples before loading…
  6. etc…
  7. etc…

Things like that. The vast majority have already known them for a long time. But now I am going deeper.Maybe some things can be solved with LUA script.Can anyone clarify? Thanks!

The example would be:

  • Use the button 1 (CC51) to collapse/expand the selected track…
  • Use the button 2 (CC52) to add/delete selected track…
  • etc…
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Raul:https://renoise.com/tools/duplex

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To see exactly what can be MIDI mapable, just klick the MIDI MAP key far up to the righ corner. That will open a window in ReNoise and there you can view a scrolldown list of all the stuff that can be MIDI maped.

Actually, like you can see from Raul’s screenshots above, the buttons lighting up are just the “tip of the iceberg”. The MIDI mapping dialog contains hundreds - thousands? - of possible mappings. Of course, they are not all useful to everybody but it’s def. worth checking out

That means getting a Taktik in the middle, and now he’s busy with something other than Renoise.

…

I hope Danoise reads this and helps.Maybe I can write the code…

Like I said, this is definitely something that could be done with a tool. Not only that, but a well-implemented tool would be indistinguishable from a native application. And if you ask me, that’s a good thing - assuming of course that the tool does not fall into the abyss of un-maintained code.

I’ve been thinking about this since I posted that “tool sketch” above. Main challenge is to prevent MIDI from entering the pattern when you don’t want it to. Toblerpone pointed out that this could be as simple as setting the routed MIDI input to “none” - but that will still pass on MIDI when you have your controller selected in the Renoise preferences (then the controller works in the default manner, passing to whatever instrument is selected). Several of my own tools completely bypasses the built-in MIDI and instead, interfaces directly with the controller. I think this is not necessary in this case, but I need to check a few things first.

Bottom line: expect some kind of tool “draft” to appear shortly. Give some feedback, and then we’ll create an actual, working tool with all the finesse that makes it something you’d actually use?