Midi Keyboard Recording Doubles Steps

With version 2.5.0 I just noticed a very annoying issue.

I have a small 2 octave midi keyboard/controller (M-Audio / Evolution MK-225C) hooked up via USB. Since the new version, whenever I go into record mode and select a step size, it get’s doubled. So for instance, if I select step 2, each hit on the midi keyboard goes 4 steps further.

At first I thought it was an issue of Renoise picking up some additional commands, so I unchecked all the extra items in Preferences -> Midi (aftertouch, program changes, …) ; didn’t change a thing. Since I also have several hardware synths, I tried the same using those, then the steps are correct. Also when recording from the computer keyboard, step size is correct.

To rule out I was going insane, and the midi keyboard/controller wasn’t broken, I started Renoise v2.1.0 again. All steps were correct. Started 2.5.0 again : step size doubled again.

Any idea what is going on ?


I wanted to add, that when I disable “Chord Mode”, the steps are normal. When I enable “Chord Mode” again, steps are again doubled for this USB Midi Keyboard.

To the left of Vol/Pan/Dly, what does it say in your instance of Renoise?

More info: http://tutorials.renoise.com/wiki/Pattern_Editor#Pattern_Editor_Control_Panel

Is it already when you press your key or when you release your key?
If other hardware synths don’t behave like this it sounds like some configuration on your USB midi keyboard or something in the message protocol.
Does something appear in the effect column when you press a key? (like an extra midi command being transmitted in serial behind your stroke)

Something similar happened to me with chord mode a couple of weeks ago, but the problem only lasted a few moments and disappeared before I managed to track down the source. I spent around 20 minutes trying to recreate it, but could not cause it again, so I just forgot about it really.

It wasn’t double spacing for me though, it was actually double notes being recorded into the pattern via computer keyboard. Maybe some kind of weird quirk that appears in the key handler, or in whatever system is used to handle the chord entry? Seems like a very rare case where perhaps the order of events gets a bit mixed up somewhere, and then maybe some stuff that should have been released internally got missed, and that is somehow causing extra phantom events to appear?

Who the hell knows :P

In my case it was happening on keydown.

Tested it once again :

  • I press a key on the USB Midi Keyboard : note/velocity is recorded
  • I release the key, double the steps are taken

It’s really weird. Certainly because in every previous version (I’ve been using this thing since v1.2) this wasn’t the case. And as said previously, in Renoise 2.1.0 everything functions normal (as expected)

Here is a screenshot of an empty song, with the step set default to 1

  • Track 1 = 3 presses on the USB MIDI keyboard
  • Track 2 = 3 presses on a KORG DS-8

Track 1 skips an extra step, whereas track 2 doesn’t (as expected).

Juno: Would be great if you could take a look at what exactly your Evolution sends to Renoise; with for example MIDI OX or other MIDI monitor applications.

I can’t replicate this here, but probably this only happens with after touch?


I’ll have a look this evening when I’m back at home with MIDI OX, I have that installed anyway to route midi out clock to all the synths to sync the BPM’s. If you have a pointer where to look, I keep you posted. Still makes me wonder, did any of the MIDI In code change between 2.1.0 (and older) and 2.5.0 ?

MIDI keyboards now always record/enter chords when you press more than one key at once…

BTW: have you tested this with an instrument loaded?

Yes, the screenshots were made while a VST intrument was loaded. But previously I noticed it when I tried to program a drum track with some samples, and noticed this issue. Then I tried several VST’s and still had this issue.

Taktik, I have more information for you.

Below a piece of the monitor data using MIDI-OX. I was watching the input of the USB MIDI Keyboard and the input where the Korg DS-8 is connected to :

-> USB MIDI Keyboard is “IN 5”
-> Korg DS-8 is “IN 14”

You can clearly see that for some reason the USB MIDI keyboard sends 2 “Note Off” commands after each other, whereas the Korg doesn’t do this. So I investigated a bit further. The USB keyboard also has a MIDI out, to rule out some of the driver/USB quircks I connected the USB MIDI keyboard with the MIDI OUT to one of my MIDI Inputs on the MIDI interface : same thing : dual “Note Off” events. I even turned the damn thing off and on again, to reset it, same thing.

I opened Renoise v2.1.0 while monitoring the MIDI data with step size 1

v2.1.0 -> Pressed key -> Note On recorded -> Release Key -> one step further
MIDI-OX -> … -> Note On -> … -> dual note off

I opened Renoise v2.5.0 while monitoring the MIDI data with step size 1

v2.5.0 -> Pressed key -> Note On recorded -> Release Key -> 2 steps further
MIDI-OX -> … -> Note On -> … -> dual note off

So for some reason, v2.1.0 ignores the extra Note Off where v2.5.0 doesn’t ?

Thanks for the details Juno.

I can not really imagine for what a double Note Off is useful for, and never have heard of a MIDI keyboard which does this as a “feature”. Probably your keyboard simply is broken?

If you know what causes this, this is not really a big deal for you and nothing we have to take care of?

I can’t really imagine why it would be useful either. If there’s nothing that can be done to prevent the outcome, and nobody else has a likewise problem, I suppose I should temporary work around this issue by unticking chord mode / just using half of the desired step size.

I probably end up buying a new little MIDI keyboard though. Despite the HW Synths with keys, I liked this little thing because it was just next to my computer keyboard, ideal for finding / trying out riffs/melody lines and it had some controller buttons that I could map.

Still, it beats me why it hasn’t caused any problem in any of the previous versions but since the 2.5.0 release it does.

Anyway : if nothing can be done against this : if any of the fellow renoise users could confirm that they don’t have the issue with a

then I’d like to hear about this. So I can replace this “faulty” MIDI Keyboard / controller. Or if any other experiences with a 2 octave (25keys) MIDI device : I’m happy to hear about this.


Just to inform you all :

I bought the E-MU Xboard 25 (felt better for key weight than the M-Audio Oxygen series) and the issue is solved. So yes, probably the old MIDI Keyboard went faulty some time ago (maybe from the beginning ?), but during previous Renoise versions wasn’t an issue. I’ll just have it at hand as a spare or so.


Don’t throw away that keyboard, I’ve got the same problem with mine, an allesis a6 I use it as a master keyboard by midi.

when I play notes “live” and record them I see double notes off, after every note played. When I set my step on 1 and play a note the first step is filled with a note the second is empty and on the third is my cursor.

I have to delete all extra notes off to hear what I really played.


When I use record/play, and I press a note on the keyboard, I see the note played, the next step is a note off, and after a while comes the, note off, I really played.

I use this keyboard for about 3 years now, and I never had this problem with renoise or with other sequencers.


I was 5 minutes ago trying to make a break in my milion dollar hit. I thought a string will do it. I couldn’t let the string hold on for longer than 3 seconds, after the three seconds renoise sends a note off to the synth, I couldn’t find the note off written anywhere.

I noticed something else, when I press a key on the synth, I see 2 lights flash, one for the midi out and one for the midi in (this is correct coz the synth tells to renoise that renoise has to play a note of the synth. After 3 seconds the midi out (out for renoise) light flashes again (out of nowhere) and the synth stops playing, when I let the key go, two lights flash again.

This all looks like my wife, when wo go to a bar and she doesn’t want me to get drunk.


what can this be?