How capable is Renoise when it comes to mixing? If I’d have a complex project and would want to do it solely in Renoise, how crippled would I be compared to standard DAWs? I’m talking both how much can be done and how quickly it can be done. Also, does the 3.0 version bring a substantial change in this department?
Sorry if I’m understating (maybe it’s equally capable and this sounds like an insult), but because Renoise is a tracker, it’s easy to assume that it’s not a tool fit for the job.
I love the idea of using a tracker, horizontal view while making music is such a pain in the ass (million of keyboard shortcuts and still so little data on screen and so little feeling of control), but bouncing everything across DAWs and mixers nullifies a lot of advantages of faster workflow which trackers obviously have to offer, so had to ask
Issues you may or may not run into, depending on what you want to do:
There isn’t a “bounce” feature. I think there is a tool that basically does that somewhere. But as far as a native integrated easy to use track bounce, there isn’t one.
There are no audio tracks in Renoise. You can pretty much accomplish almost everything audio tracks can do but putting an audio file in the sampler and recording the note to play it in a pattern. But if you’re looking for comparing multiple waveforms, or sliding a piece of audio forward or backward, you’re kind of SOL
Audio routing is not entirely free. There are send tracks, but you cannot send to a normal track, and you cannot send right to left. You can however easily insert a send into any point of a plugin chain.
Adding to above, there is no way to do side-chaining or use any plugin that relies on routing audio from a different track into it.
You cannot automated post-fx track levels. You can however insert a gainer at the end of your chain and automate that.
Because sends are inserts, they will always occur before the post-fx track level, so you will have to either manually match the send level with the post-fx track level or use a gainer before the send to set levels instead of the track level. This makes setting levels more difficult in general if you use sends to Reverb, which you probably will be. This isn’t a “it’s impossible to do” limitation though, it’s just a “it’s harder to do than it should be” limitation.
Other than those things though, I should think it would be fine. I really like Renoise’s mixer sliders. They have a weight to them. My other DAW is Reaper and the sliders are super slippery and it makes it really hard to hone in on the desired gain.
I use it exclusively and I love/hate it for mixing. I don’t bother with the faders, use a gainer instead. Pre fx fader messes up level dependent fx like compressors and post fx fader messes up the levels in relation to any sends you might have.
The lack of bouncing options is annoying. I often find myself running out of cpu power and having to get creative with exporting or rendering.
The compressor meter is wrong.
I do find it fiddly but it works for me at the end of it all.
I’ve only been using Renoise for maybe 6-12 months, but I’ve found it OK for all but_final_mixing duties.
Even that could be done OK, but is a bit better in Reaper for me with extra flexibility for send busses, audio editing etc.
How are you getting your song from Renoise to Reaper? I’ve tried exporting a song to separate track files but it’s never the same results as when I export the entire song to a single file. Part of it may be how send tracks are involved when you select separate files for each track, but I don’t think that’s all of it. Some problem when using groups; something is lost if I try to get a set of individual track files.
I end up getting as good a sound as I can in Renoise then using Reaper on the final stereo wav to do some final adjustments, but that’s then that’s more mastering than mixing.
I do it. I mix as I go though. Sure it isn’t as convenient as Reaper but it gets the job done for me. And I get to avoid the obnoxious process of transferring wav files to another host. Really hate messing around with that. Total buzzkill…
Besides sticking to Renoise no matter what always turns out to be the better idea for me
Thanks for all your answers. So even though the list of things that could be better is moderately long even after 5 posts, it looks like those are all minor problems. I was afraid of random rendering errors complaints or something. Road clear, I guess!
I’m not doing many mixes in Renoise, but the first thing which strikes me is that I’m unable to multi-select tracks. Sometimes you want to select all tracks and drag the sliders all the way down. Could be useful if you want to for instance start all over with volume adjustments, or if some tracks should have the same settings etc.Not sure if it’s a minor or major problem, but I really miss it.
I’m a fan of The Recording Revolution (http://therecordingrevolution.com/); I’ve learned a number of useful things from that site and the videos.
A key takeaway is that while having slick top-notch equipment is nice, it’s generally not the deciding factor in getting a good mix.
I think at worst using only Renoise would mean certain things are trickier or or more tedious than they might be with some other tool, but at the end of the day if you have decent EQ and compression, decent monitors, use good reference tracks, and apply some taste you can get good mixes.
I was reading an article about the mixing of Call Me Maybe (http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/sep12/articles/it-0912.htm) and I starting thinking that just maybe this is all a lot of bullshit. People like to think having a few dozen stems on every track and running everything through multiple pricey FX and filters really matters, but it’s just audio homeopathy. It’s like those gold-plated Monster Cables.
I’m sure there are people who claim they can hear the difference, but I’m skeptical.
Thanks for all your answers. So even though the list of things that could be better is moderately long even after 5 posts, it looks like those are all minor problems. I was afraid of random rendering errors complaints or something. Road clear, I guess!
I think that’s a very accurate assessment. Renoise may not do all the things we would like it to do, but things it does do it does extremely well. Very reliable and stable.
There are a few things that is easier in other DAWs, but at the end of it, Renoise does all i need and i don’t use any other DAWs at the moment.
Automating tracks is a bit more fiddly, because you can’t see the waveform like in a normal sequencer.
I also think if all DSPs had a VU-meter it would make the mixing a lot easier. A tiny bit of distortion somewhere in the chain can ruin the whole mix, so it would be very useful to immediately spot which one is in the red. Not just that, but a lot of VSTs and DSPs needs a certain level to sound optimal.
Renoise is pretty darn rock solid. I wouldn’t swap it for anything in the world.
I’ve learned a number of useful things from that site and the videos.