More Meta Devices

Hello.

I’ve been thinking about what kind of new meta-devices i’d like to see in future versions of Renoise.

Did a quick search and didn’t find any threads about this? so here goes nothing.

  • A new meta device that tracks the ‘output level/amplitude’ of a user selectable track.

This value could be used to modulate effect parameters just like the LFO meta-device does today, it could be called ‘level tracker’, it would need some form of ‘smoothing’ or ‘average the buffer’ to get smooth values.

As an example track #1 could have a ‘level tracker’ that tracks level of track #2 and applies the value to a selected effect parameter on track #1.

So put a ‘level tracker’(that meassures level of track 2) and a filter(that is modulated by the output from the level tracker) on track 1 and well, you’d get a pretty whacked filter that is controlled by the ouput level from track 2.

It should also be possible to ‘invert’ the value one gets from the track level so it would be possible to apply negative modulation.

  • A simple envelope that is triggered by setting a threshold level of a user selectable track, the envelopes value could be used to modulate other effects.

Again applied in the same way as the ‘level tracker’ this would make it possible to do simple gating based on another tracks content by simply asigning the output value of the envelope to the track volume.

  • Kill track output

This would be usefull to eliminate output(to master or send effects) of a track that is only used modulation purposes by the above meta devices.

I bet there are tons of ideas for new meta-devices just waiting to pop up.

Well.

I’d rather use a load of meta-deveices to shape the sound than those annoying VST plugs just to get effects that are almost possible to do with the built in DSP if they had a bit more controllability.

The ‘new’ Meta Devices could be eliminated if a TrackDSP effect could get it’s modulation input from another track(ie. input a track as a Mod/level-value instead of audio stream) and make it possible to apply som processing logic to it(ie. set threshold for triggering things, invert etc).

I’m sorry if i upset the devs. with this issue but meta-devices have soo much potential to bee really cool and useful things.

No no. All I said was that the Track -> Instrument linking that is done by the MetaDevices are evil.
Your ideas are track based and I like them a lot. Post all the ideas you have! :)

I really like the level tracker! Isn’t that like an analog envelope follower btw?

I thought I could develop the idea a bit… The invert button is a good idea. The smooth control could maybe be done with two sliders for attach and release (like a compressor). For example if you hook up a filter cut-off up to a bass drum you probably want a fast attach response and then let it decay a bit longer. I would also add gainer and offset sliders.

Nice ASCII pic of all this… :)

---------- Level tracker ----------  
Attack: 0ms -----> 10ms  
Release: 0ms -----> 100ms  
Gain: 0% -----> 400%  
Offset: -50% -----> 50%  
Invert: []  
---------------------------------------  

And then how about a sample & hold to use on the LFO and level tracker?

You got it!

Other uses would be to adjust ‘width’ based on a tracks level.

To add ‘meta-devices’ to the list.

  • “Alias TrackDSP from Track #”
    This would use another tracks TrackDSP(Effectively create a new ‘alias chain’).
    So any changes made to the Source Track’s DSP would also affect the Alias-tracks DSP.

Send tracks will still serve a purpose, this would just apply the same effects individually to each track instead of a mixed soup.

  • “Mix With Channel #”
    Could be used to create x-fade between 2 tracks.

Uses would be to simulate different velocities for example.
Take 2 piano samples, soft hit and hard hit.
Put the same melody on 2 tracks(one track uses the hard hit and one uses the soft).
Use the Mix with channel metadevice to control note on velocity to alter the timbre of the sound. (at least this would save one from entering volume column values on 2 tracks).

  • “Adjust Instrument envelope points”

This would make it possible change some envelope values.
(Personally i’d use this to alter the first value of the filter envelope).

Maybe we’ll se a bunch of new meta-devices in Renoise 1.6-7-8 who knows.

The idea is nice, have you experimented with the send-tracks to see if you can use modulation tricks through them?

Not that it will offer what you want, but there are always ways to achieve things on a regular basis.

In what ways are existing VST’s incapable or unsufficient of doing this particular track-input job?

Well…

There are some VST’s out there but i don’t have loads of cash to spend on plug-ins when the solution lies behind a few lines of code and since music is a hobby of mine i can wait.

But even if there are VST’s how do i route stuff to them?(Lets pretend i have a VST-FX that has 3 inputs for modulation, and i wan’t track #1 to modulate Track #2 and ouput the result to Track #3). Most plug-ins only accept one stereo/dual-mono source.

It’s a no go at the moment, and i’d really prefer trackbased effects rather than getting another mixer to wire/route the stuff to(This wire stuff is one reason i’m fedup with Reason).

There are some VST-effects that use Left/Right channels in creative ways(mda Vocoder being one of them). In this case i can pan tracks 1&2 Left&Right and send them to a track effect and mute the source.