haha np, I jump at any opportunity to rant 
It can be daunting sometimes, having the absolute freedom that renoise offers, so you can always enter themed competitions, they give you a concept and limitations to run with…
A general reply, not necessarily aimed to Johann.
Over a period of time, you’ll not only be using your ears but your mind. What I mean by that is, that you’ll be able to distinguish sounds, and notes & the ever under-mentioned intervals.
Get to know the sounds of intervals in your notes, what does 3 notes sound like away to the left and to the right after the first note you hit ? what does 4 notes sound like and so on and so on.
I personally don’t use scales anymore, I just feel it out. For me it’s different for chords (some people call them harmony) and from my own personal experience, it helps to know the rules and to know really how chords work, for me this was more of a headache than learning counterpoint, well, maybe they’re both headaches… maybe I just erased the headache part in learning counterpoint from my memory since its a lot of fun to do, now that I know how it works.
Get to know your ADSR even though you might not be playing with synths. It helps on analyzing any given sound you hear. How Attack-full is the volume, How long does the volume Decay, How long is the pitch Sustained until it changes, How long does it take to silence when I Release a key or button ?
imo, one problem when people start discussing music theory it’s kind of unclear what they mean by it
Music theory is the field of study that deals with how music works. It examines the language and notation of music. It identifies patterns that govern composers’ techniques. In a grand sense, music theory distills and analyzes the parameters or elements of music – rhythm, harmony (harmonic function), melody, structure, form, and texture. Broadly, music theory may include any statement, belief, or conception of or about music
so looking at what happens in a merzbow piece is also music theorizing. (= the discussion here on this board about how to get that sweet gabber kick is music theory too, i guess.
we’d have to define “music” in the first place 
So music theory is to making music what being a critic is to writing a book?
Hmm, I knew that already… I looked it up in my gut 
Just have to add my 2 cents coming from the perspective of someone with a decent foundation in music theory!
I barely use it! Don’t worry, it is helpful but NOT neccessary! Just maybe learn the major and minor scales shapes in one or two keys that u like…stick to playing in one key even for now to make your life easier. Metallica practically wrote all of their songs in E minor!
Also learn a triad(3 notes of a chord, root, third and fifth)…then just get to making music!! I have read a little of the advice given, most of it is right on! ie…sticking to one note for bassline etc… It is true that it does depend on what type of music you are writing, however, even with melodic trance u just need to stay in key(as a musician I believe in writing your own music, however, many plug ins have sequencer features which are great for melodic passages)!!
A lot of electronic esp dance music is just what you do with effects…imo, learning to use renoise is more important than learning music theory for you.
I used to try and valiantly defend music theory to all the haters out there that say that it sucks/is inhibiting/is unnecessary, and now I just think of it as a tool in my toolkit that a lot of other people don’t have. 
But I absolutely try to apply everything I know about music to all my stuff, electronic or not.
On a related but different topic, a lot of people in this thread seem to be confusing “music theory” with “harmony.” There’s a lot more to it than that, that’s only one dimension of music theory out of several.
[quote name=
On a related but different topic, a lot of people in this thread seem to be confusing “music theory” with “harmony.” There’s a lot more to it than that, that’s only one dimension of music theory out of several.
[/quote]
Gr8 point! I was thinking of ammending my post…Imo Rhythm is most important facet of music theory in electronic/dance music as u can make a track with drums and one bassnote! So wrap ur head around rhythm as that is the foundation on which all the other elements of music are built! 
No matter what tools and techniques you use, there’s also the matter of maintenance and memory, after all, almost everything decays at one point or another.
Maintain your tools, I’m mainly speaking of hardware, including the computer, just like a mechanic maintains engines and parts. The more varied gear you get your hands on, the more you need to know how to take care of it.
Notation has and still serving music for the purpose of memory. It’s a bit different for computer involved music. When your vst, samples, and tunes accumulate, you’ll most likely need memory and a reliable method in keeping it all organized and intact for the ever dreaded day which has no name because its cruel and evil.
ye, i know… but imo that’s becuase people think that music theory is basically just about boring old “white note scale” diatonic stuff or some old ass II-V-I jazz chords.
I’m not touching this with a ten foot pole. Oh well, I did already…
That is the funny thing in these conversations, people who dis musical theory has no clue what it is about and how it is used. That may be a cause or an effect.
now that’s some mighty big words… care to post some of your music, just so I can put them into perspective…?
I do think it’s an issue of learning the software. You need to have used everything 5 times the wrong way before you can get ideas like “hey, now if I do X then Y”… seeing several steps at one time, getting sort of a bigger picture… it just takes time!
You have to get used to the controls in the cockpit before you can do airshows… it just takes time and passion. And since this is NOT flying a plane, and unless you’re needlessly stuck up you can NOT damage anything or get hurt by making shitty music – so this is exactly the one and only analogy I can get behind with a clear conscience.
While someone saying “oh no, you first have to LEARN it without actually DOING it” would be a liar, a traitor, a child of the devil who can only lie. Hah.
time * passion = good music. Either dispute that, or ACCEPT the resulting conclusion that theory is next to useless (to a.) musicians, who b.) don’t play in a band etc., where of course it’s useful to say “let’s do the next one in G#, with a froolnix shuffle”) since learning theory takes up time and usually decreases passion… I’d rather go for a walk or get laid, and then just invest time in banging keyboard keys and clicking frantically… if I really feel it, other people will feel it, too. If I really am sincere about it, I will improve automatically and not even notice it.
Oh, and listening to good music is obviously mandatory, too. Absorb it. Also listen to your own stuff on the mp3 player while out and about.
Be happy and be sad. That is much more important than scales – LOL!!! (if a chord consists of three notes, how do you call stuff that consists of 2 or 4 notes? oh right, you don’t, you just enjoy making it and listening to it)
Music is an expression of emotion and soul. So yeah, working on your sensibilty and metal agility is as much, if not MORE important than “handling your tools” (bleeeeeghgegegegeheggeh I need to wash my eyes with bleach when I read sentiments like that).
Another thing to piss people off: just because there are so many soulless people who dance to soulless music, doesn’t make it dance music. It’s just a cage in which people twitch.
You wanna MAKE MUSIC, right? Not bore chicks with theoretical discussions on it, or be a hired hand playing the compositions of someone else — right?? So there.
This also obligatory and cannot be posted often enough.
It’s like garlic scented holy water, bathe in it.
Kameleontti is right, abandon thread.
I don’t know how you interpreted those words, but that is a conclusion I have made from what I have read and heard. I did not claim that I’m a musical guru or analyst, I am neither. If I was a guru, a prodigy, I had learned much of the theory spontaneously (or by passion, as above is said). If I was an analyst, I had names for everything but could not pull off an application. Most people are in between, they need some knowledge to understand the function. So I don’t think musical theory is nonsense as general, but it might have many applications, some suitable for musician, some for composer, some for analyst, but generally a reference, not a dogma.
Most tracker people probably won’t bother because of the nature of music they make and the way it is performed. Now if you want to know if I know the theory - yes I do, but just some, very little, and generally haven’t had the interest of purging into it just for the sake of it.
I shouldn’t touched this with a ten foot pole. 
LOOK AT MY BOLD LETTERS IT MAKES ME COHERENT
You want, I am, we need.
Not to be an ass, but I’m very bored of your writing style. You make good points, but your writing is so over the top and narcissistic it’s somewhere between lame and depressing.
Music theory is subjective to each persons point of view.
Books are pointless in my opinion, watch some of the producer masterclasses on youtube, they explain more than any book ever will in my opinion.
One of the most inspiring things I’ve seen is the Mistabishi masterclass.
There’s loads more too on youtube too