I made an upright-bass instrument in Redux, and I’m having trouble stoping the clicking and popping:https://www.dropbox.com/s/uy32ju5gawwqo0n/acoubass.xrni?dl=0
Is there a way of cross fading the note-offs into the end of the sample cut-off to stop the clicks? I tried AHDSR but it still seems to click on the release sample.
By enabling the button with the fading out wave, you can let Redux and Renoise fade the begin/end of a sample automatically.
Thanks, I forgot about that one! It’s close, but maybe the stereo samples have different cut marks since I assembled them from two mic recordings. The fade length cant be adjusted, can it?
To be honest I actually thought it not bad without the note offs…but there again I’m no Charlie Mingus unfortunately.
Very nice instrument! Good use of the note-off layer also. May I use it in a tune or two?
I made a little quite fast lick with it, and had a digital click only on a single note within it. Not drastic, but different from the slappieness noises that are in the samples. Adding a vol envelope with instant sustain and a short (curve envelope) release to the instruments mod set fixed it for me. Sorry, I’ve accidentally not saved the lick/fix.
This is the logic behind it - create fade in’s in the beginnings of the sample data if they click on start in undesireable fashion, and then release stages to prevent them clicking when cut. Yes the sample fade in/out function will still generate some transient, not as strong as direct click, but noticeable on bass sounds.
Could you maybe upload some xrns with note data that triggers the clicks more prominently?
good sounding instrument, btw
To be honest I actually thought it not bad without the note offs…but there again I’m no Charlie Mingus unfortunately.
What a beautiful song, I love the smooth-jazz touch, it extraordinary what you managed to do with the bass instrument, sounds like real playing!
Glad you both like it, feel free to use and enjoy it! I have an example I made in Reaper with Redux that shows the clicking and popping, I can upload that in a bit if you have redux? Or I can try and recreate it in Renoise. I think the popping might be coming from the note-offs, strangely enough when I pitched down 4-teys version it still popped until I made the envelope modulator 8ms attack and release. That fixed it, but $teys has the note-offs removed. DO volume modulations work on note-offs as well as regular notes?
the note off layer samples seem to get fed thru the mod set associated with normally, with exceptions. envelopes will effect, but ignore any hold/release markers. adhsrs seem to jump to the release stage. sample loops will also be ignored.
you can push note-off samples to different mod sets than the note-on samples. this is what I did, sorry I forgot to write. the note-on samples mod set gets short volume release via envelope (yes around 8-12ms should be fine), while the note-off samples get played normally. this seems to prevent the pops in sound. you don’t need attack stage as the samples are fine, the note off samples do need some weak plop sound for the impression of a string being stopped, just not such a harsh one.
I think the harsh pops come from the note-on samples being abruptly cut. it is the bassy samples where this is most apparent - imagine a sine wave that gets cut abruptly during one of its peaks…if will become a sharp transient. sometimes by chance it won’t be cut in its peak, but close to zero, then the pop will be too faint to be heard. with short release stage the sine gets “faded out” in a way that wouldn’t cause such waveforms. it can be most apparent with your instrument when you have a rather low, dull note and then put note off and then silence. First I did runs mostly without pauses, and the attack of each new note would mostly mask the popping sound.
well, the sample data in many of the samples is cut before the note fades to silence, so pops are built into many of samples themselves as the sudden drop to 0 at the sample data end. if the sample plays to the end before any applied volume envelope ends completely you will hear a pop anyway.
i would go through all the samples in the editor, select the last couple of wavecycles and apply a fade to them and see how much unwanted noises this eliminates.
the note off layer samples seem to get fed thru the mod set associated with normally, with exceptions. envelopes will effect, but ignore any hold/release markers. adhsrs seem to jump to the release stage. sample loops will also be ignored.
you can push note-off samples to different mod sets than the note-on samples. this is what I did, sorry I forgot to write. the note-on samples mod set gets short volume release via envelope (yes around 8-12ms should be fine), while the note-off samples get played normally. this seems to prevent the pops in sound. you don’t need attack stage as the samples are fine, the note off samples do need some weak plop sound for the impression of a string being stopped, just not such a harsh one.
I think the harsh pops come from the note-on samples being abruptly cut. it is the bassy samples where this is most apparent - imagine a sine wave that gets cut abruptly during one of its peaks…if will become a sharp transient. sometimes by chance it won’t be cut in its peak, but close to zero, then the pop will be too faint to be heard. with short release stage the sine gets “faded out” in a way that wouldn’t cause such waveforms. it can be most apparent with your instrument when you have a rather low, dull note and then put note off and then silence. First I did runs mostly without pauses, and the attack of each new note would mostly mask the popping sound.
So, in the instrument you sent me, are the note-offs still actually in the sampler? I thought you’d removed them? I’ll take another look…
No, I did not upload any fix of your instrument, maybe you are mixing me up with 4tey. I did only describe my thoughts and results of experimentation.
oneunkind is also right, the very low notes get cut abruptly while in vibration. this can be fixed in the samplea if you add a fadeout at the ends of them, or loop the samples so the notes could be held. I’d go for fadeout tho, these are pluck notes after all.
I must also say the instrument has another flaw not talked about yet: you seem to layer 2 individual samples for each note, one panned left the other right. But most of them are out of phase, and this can be problematic, more so as these are bass samples. It gives them quite some stereo width, I also like layering variations of instruments this way. but the low freqs/mids might cancel each other on some notes, or become very muddy on mono subwoofers.
Oh I see (just in case you are getting me and Oopsl mixed up fineprimitivesounds…errrrr easy thing to do 
) Yes I deleted the note off samples, this to be truthful was to reduce the resulting example file size as it runs over the 2MB upload limit otherwise. It has little to do with your original question about applying small fade outs on note offs to try and reduce the ‘clicks’ etc… I tend to deal more with trying to compose notes rather than stereo width/sample clicks/how much reverb/compressors/eq/mastering etc… sound design 
Here I attach the version I’m currently working with, I think I’ll try to make some softish drum&bass tune ala roni size from it. My aim was to let it sound gritty and natural in play. Yes I added clicks so to say with distortion, but it is just amplifying the noises from the recordings, not giving artefacts that shouldn’t be there I think. I did various changes to the instrument and samples and added processing to the instrument. I converted the samples to .ogg to make it <2mb.
Here I attach the version I’m currently working with, I think I’ll try to make some softish drum&bass tune ala roni size from it. My aim was to let it sound gritty and natural in play. Yes I added clicks so to say with distortion, but it is just amplifying the noises from the recordings, not giving artefacts that shouldn’t be there I think. I did various changes to the instrument and samples and added processing to the instrument. I converted the samples to .ogg to make it <2mb.
Thanks, I’ll download this and give it a play! But I do need to address that phase issue, I don’t suppose Redux/Renoise has an automatic phase adjustment tool that could fix the issue by offsetting them slightly?
Oh I see (just in case you are getting me and Oopsl mixed up fineprimitivesounds…errrrr easy thing to do
) Yes I deleted the note off samples, this to be truthful was to reduce the resulting example file size as it runs over the 2MB upload limit otherwise. It has little to do with your original question about applying small fade outs on note offs to try and reduce the ‘clicks’ etc… I tend to deal more with trying to compose notes rather than stereo width/sample clicks/how much reverb/compressors/eq/mastering etc… sound design
It’s such a beautiful song, I can’t believe it’s just a test piece!
look in the instrument fx at how I solved the phase issue - I bandsplit the sounds, sub/bass reduced strong, mids moderate, top only little to preserve the width that was in the samples a little and keep some stereo dancing action. Also I think I manually realigned some of the samples l/r tracks to result in what I thought was slightly better corellation.
In recording there it is usual when having tracks from different mics, to shift them against each other until they are more in-phase. If room or mic played extra tricks, allpass filters can come into play shifting only certain frequencies, mostly the bass. I dunno how your samples were created, I guess all of this would have to be done in the very start after recording the tracks. And you cannot expect samples from different plucks to be in phase at all.
In fact, stereo l/r layering variation samples is some very effective way to achive real big stereo width, I love this technique and thought you had done it to the bass by purpose and just missed to keep the bass narrow.
