Something that this thread made me think about is the relevance of audio source in music. Why oh why, dare I ask, is it important were the sounds come from? I know, before I get buried under the storm of feces, that the actual machines have a certain special something that just isn’t easily reproduced by samples and vsts (and everything else with a computer-origin that is demonized). What is so horrible about using only partial hardware and physical equipment to produce any given part of any given track? What is the fascination with releasing albums and EPs? Why not just make loads of music for yourself rather than sweat bullets over getting popular? And again why does using hardware instruments seem so essential to becoming popular? In my opinion it shouldn’t matter how a song is made as long as the end result is enjoyable, and to hell with audiophiles. If my friends like my tracks thats good enough for me, if I can spread a message because of my skills then even better. Its this industry mindset that could possibly destroy breakcore. Don’t buy into it.
Again: WHY DOES IT MATTER HOW IT IS MADE IF YOU CAN’T EVEN TELL THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN REAL AND SIMULATED INSTRUMENTS???
personally i feel that hardware sometimes make it seem more human. like on kanye west’s song love lockdown, you can hear the noise in the channel. which i was like, this is real. also, i make music for myself. the only reason its online is cause my friends want to hear it and i’m to lazy to burn cds. i dont care where the sounds come from, i personally use samples and vsts all the time. just as long as it sounds how i want it to, then its a good song to me, and its good enough
I think the answer to your anger and complaints is right there in your own comment. If you think your own music sounds great with samples and VSTs, then you should just happily use them and ignore the conversations about hardware. No one in this thread is personally telling other people, “If you don’t use strictly hardware, you’re a talentless fraud.” It seems to me like they’re just chatting about how one particular album was made (Aaron’s “1961.”)
Also, “getting popular” is extremely relative, based on what genre you’re discussing. When these guys get popular, they’re not like Guns N’ Roses-foreign-governments-are-going-apeshit popular. They’re just kids who have a couple hundred or thousand people grabbing EPs and going to shows. And some of them started by doing what you say you like doing: they just made music for their friends. And then word of mouth spread, more people got interested because their friends told THEIR friends they heard some good tracks, and BAM - fanbase.
P.S. None of the artists mentioned here are breakcore.
P.P.S. Luke Vibert works solely with Propellerhead Reason, believe it or not!
Night Driller, I make music for myself and my friends too and sometimes release it when my friend Mike bugs me enough to put some out on his label. don’t think anyone was saying music made with hardware is any more valid than with software. personally I don’t care what something was made on, as long as it sounds great, I will listen to it. have days where I don’t want to use any software and also days where I don’t want to use any hardware, most days I want both, s’all about whatever floats your boat at the moment. as far as destroying breakcore goes, I think breakcore destroys itself by being breakcore, as does anything that attempts to adhere to such predisposed modes or rules, generifications, staying within the lines or whatever you wanna call it. I wanna hear deep house thrash metal waltz music with dead country singers yelling in languages they don’t speak!
edit: guess he started using it in 2004 “My first Reason project was Amen Andrews in 2003, then YosepH which was part Reason, part analogue. The first all-Reason project was Kerrier District in 2004, followed by Wagon Christ’s Sorry I make you Lush which was all Reason too.” I really like Yoseph and would recommend it to anyone who hasn’t heard it
NOw that’s nothing more than a marketing stunt …ever heard a convincing 303 out of reason ? I don’t think so …I am sure vibert uses a lot of hardware sources ( 101,303,808 you name it ) and some reason for slicing up his audio material …don’t believe everything you read ( hmmm paradox ?)
I apologize for the anger in my previous post. I’ve been watching WAY too much youtube. The people on there talk constant smack about everyone on every subject. I can’t believe I let their opinions get to me so much that I actually started hating my own music and now I’m all defensive and crap. I’m sorry. Prolonged lack of trees could also be to blame for my agitation, horrible excuse I know, but thats another story.
Anyway I love Last Step and the Analord series. I’ve had some psychedelic experiences while listening to that music. Its what got me into acid actually. Anyway I didn’t mean to ruin the fun.
Quoting Luke Vibert again from the interview on Propellerheads site "Q What about all your 303 sounds?
A I’ve got a real 303 alongside Reason and I just sample it - I splice it up in 8 bar loops or whatever… "
Then again, I remember reading a comparing test of hardware 303 clones and the result was that they were all nice but Propellerheads Rebirth software clone beat them all. I think it was this site: http://www.acidvoice.com/
Yo Aaron! Cheers for the recommendations. I’ve wanted one of those 1961s for about 12 years btw.
I got myself a Yamaha QY700 h/w sequencer not long ago. Brilliant for getting away from the computer when you need to; feels really Detroit. Find myself doing completely different things with it.
@Night Driller: I agree with a lot of what you’re saying. And definetly stay away from Youtube comments pages unless you’re looking for an excuse to climb a clock tower with an automatic rifle.
With the sound source arguments, I think the part too many people miss is that electronic music’s (imo) always been much more about the relationship between the user and the technology than the end result… People get too hung up on a/b testing and trying to prove that you can do the same thing two different ways. And it’s all sort of meaningless because it’s about what actually do with what you’re working with - which, unless you’re trying to copy other people, is a completely abstract/unquantifiable thing.
Somehow I’ve become completely wrapped up on method and ergonomics, and in a weird way it’s become sort of more interesting for me to explore how these things effect how I make music than actually making cohesive end products… But I think if the process at some level isn’t something that genuinely interests you, it’s a waste of time…
I’d have to admit Rebirth’s 303 does sound quite authentic - my favourite s/w emulation. And all the h/w clones I’ve heard have definetly had their own character - (not that that’s a bad thing.)
But then again, Rebirth’s doesn’t really have that tone which could carry a track singlehandedly. (plus, you can’t program the things with a mouse.)
With things like Rebirth, which really do nail aspects of the sounds quite well in isolation (imo), it still surprises me how far you always are from making anything that really sounds or feels authentic.
I actually nicked the trick Rebirth uses for my own 808 kits though. You get an 808 Snare with no noise and layer it with one that’s been highpassed around 500-700hz. Then you just tune the first one, amp envelope the second. (when you retune an 808 Snare with the noise and hit together, you just get a silly Disco tom before long, or something which sounds like someone dropping a guitar amp.)
(…and you can actually find the Snare split into high and low in the Rebirth sample folder, although I prefer Goldbaby’s 808 samples. And then, if you’ve got an old Emu sampler, you’ve really got something that feels 808-like. There’s a subtle, overdriven dirt on the older Emus which gives small sounds a presense and physicality which it often feels like good convertors strip away.)
