This can be reduced a lot, when you use keyboard shortcut’s. Duplicate notes helps, so you don’t need to draw one note after another. In Bitwig its CTRL+D. When you hold CTRL und move selected notes, Bitwig duplicate them for you. Transpose with cursor keys (when notes are selected). With Shift + Cursor Up/Down, you can move notes 1 octave up or down. In Bitwig, when you just click, it draws your note with the last draw note length. Save also some time.
For me, the tracker view helps me not to “paint” a melody to get new ideas. But most of the time, i’m much quicker with a piano roll. For basic editing like moving multiple or even single notes from a melody around, transpose them, add new notes, change note length etc.
So I quickly deduce that Phazze is who wanted it but somehow was overruled or was beginning to back out or take a secondary seat, or whatever reason…
Many COMBOs have been made-
-Recent Psycle has LUA piano roll, don’t like it too much…
-BeRoTracker has a piano roll but it’s mono…
-DreamStation II has piano roll or tracker & you can switch back-forth, pretty nice…
-IoNeo Aero Studio has piano roll & tracker & both can be open side-side…
-BUZE has piano roll that can be opened but hard to see & way over to right side (Uggg!)
-Aodix 4.2 Has BEST integration & fluid action between both sides-
For a TRACKER person who wants some of the FLUID advantages of a piano roll I feel AODIX is-was the BEST…Also great for un-quantizing note-by-note to make more organic piece…
I have seen what there is going with that 3rd party piano-roll for renoise but doesn’t look viable…There was also a weird thing with Buzz but I can’t tolerate buzz…
For just using mouse Aero Studio pretty slick & simple you enter notes in piano roll & adjust other aspects in tracker view…
One could ALSO use any piano roll DAW & try ReVisit or…OR alternatively use a Tracker that can load VSTs & use SonicBytes Phrazor…
NOTE!!..There is a fellow who is busy coding up a fix for the issues with AODIX 4.2.0.1 whereby reloading certain plugs on next session resulted in a crash…
There will never be a Piano Roll in Renoise, it is a hobby project that pretty much only gets maintenance releases for newer OSes, the developers didnt want to add piano roll or linear arranger, so it was never commercially viable beyond that hobby project.
Enjoy it for what it is and be happy they maintain it enough to keep using it on newer systems.
What?
Being a hobby project has absolutely zero todo with something being commercially offered as a product.
A major portion of the western world tries in some way or form to make a bit of money from their hobby.
In this case well earned haha.
And it isn’t an argument either, get over yourself, and stop acting like nobody wants a Piano Roll.
Go check my posts, oh, thats right, biggest proponent of Piano Rolls on the forum.
Renoise was ONLY a hobby when they were coding NoiseTrekker 3 over 20 years ago & that was actually a donationware thing…When Renoise was being sold thereafter it BECAME COMMERCIAL & has been ever since! There is no ‘hobby’ about it…
And like I say it clearly states a piano roll is ‘on the list’ in 2003-
Hobby means they do it in their spare time, Renoise is not a full time operation.
Oh wait, you think this dwindling community, built up out of people who mostly last paid anything to the developers years ago, is a full commercial enterprise with full time developers?
Hahahahaha oh my hahahaha, let me just hahahahaha wait hahahaha 2003 hahahaha they actually think the developers are making money hahahaha.
You should be happy it gets maintenance updates and keeps working, A LOTof DAWs have disappeared in the last twenty years.
The development here is near enough done for free.
Me? Dont understand. This thread was about how to overcome pianoroll aversion as a regular tracker user.
And NOT about your fights what Renoise should be or not. It actually was about Bitwig, which is really like for the routing and modulation, but not so much for the pianoroll. In the end, Bitwig can be way more precise than Renoise from a technical perspective, if you can use it the right way, I guess. But still usually my Renoise mixes are better, my tunes, too. Maybe I should just use it way more regularly, but I always feel aversion when I open Bitwig hehe Renoise in contrast always feels like coming home to me, like booting up AmigaOS 3.0 haha That sexy GUI, those colors, aaaah nice. No bugs at all. YAY Configuring any detail just like I want it… OMG
If I take a step backwards, and try to analyze what I really do not like about a common pianoroll (here Bitwig pianoroll), then I think there are these points:
It always turns into a mouse clicking orgy, at least for me
There is no fixed raster as in Renoise, you always have to zoom in/out scroll x/y etc.
No real keyboard shortcuts like Renoise. Can’t midi record a chord without playing, can’t play the notes under the cursor without playing
No proper side-by-side view
Grid lines do not really help me, eye is totally lost, there are no anchor points at all.
In the end these seem to be suble details each on its own, but in sum, it annoys me every time.
So at least I would improve these things then:
Kind of x/y subtle highlighting the row/col I am currently targeting, like crosshairs
By default zooming in only on x-axis, remembering y-zoom. Minimum unit is a measure.
Writing notes of pianoroll also on the right
Never ever not printing note names on the bars
Not wasting so much space on the borders, so only for touch enabled devices this wasting
introducing a second “playhead” only for editing, so I can record a chord on another place in the pianoroll than the actual play position. The editing playhead does not progress and can be moved around
Removing outlines, even double outlines
Adding shortcuts to move editing playhead around, playing notes under editing playhead, all that fine Renoise stuff. Shortcuts writing/deleting/moving/shrinking a note
multi view never layered, instead each on top. Vertical and x zoom synced, playheads, too. So does not require additional borders.
Remembering a lot of view settings when coming back, saved in the song
Quantization options back into inpsector panel
drum view can have full y-size
Highlighting measures on the grid
Increasing contrast of the background pianoroll, highlighting the octave line. Increasing the contrast overall (but still obviously separating background from foreground)
Option to remove the keyboard, just confuses me, writing only note names instead (but not wasting so much space, again). Never seen a piano standing on the side…
