Renoise vs Redux

General Discussion
30

No it certainly is not but loading vsts would just make it that much more special and differ even more from the crowd.

Yeah. To clarify I meant it wouldn’t be nearly the same to drop (effect) plug-ins on either side of Redux as inserts in a DAW, as having embedded plug-in support. Also, since Redux doesn’t seem to have MIDI out for now, how would you interface it with plug-in instruments (wait for someone to ask why you’d want to!).There are useful alternatives… like passing Redux audio out into some other plug-in like Melodyne, Pitchmap, etc. Or if the phrase editor has MIDI drag & drop support… it’s not like plug-in support wouldn’t be VERY useful. But understandable if it wasn’t (or isn’t or won’t be) a focal point.

@Rashinamu that would be very interesting actually. Phraseption. It would tax the system, but most DAW’s have decent freezing/bouncing/rendering options by now.

31

if its no 1996 anymore, than i guess all daws should have 1 common thing - getting shit together. most daws projects have samples all across hdd, some factory content somwhere else, vst folder, x32 x64 bit incompabillity. thats all results in crashes and a lot of precious time lost. i mean half of the problems starts with vst caused crash. no wonder more and more people moving into hardware and saying computers are unreliable, its not computers fault that it has impossible to manage all files and configs at once.

so…

Redux is available for Windows, OSX and Linux, in VST and AudioUnit formats. Your license does not restrict you to any particular platform, and is fully portable.

Faith in computers being restored.

32

@lolfail: I’m sorry to hear your experience with computers has been this bad. Though more and more people saying computers are unreliable? Surely they can get a good book on how to use one :stuck_out_tongue: ?

If redux would support vsts, it would instantly become relevant to so many that don’t givea damn about the tracker, even in it’s current state. It’s not just instruments your getting (though surely many will be most pleased to run looped phraseat999BPM 256 LPB (slightly exaggerating the numbers here)). You get vst effects that can be routed anyway you want and that can be controlled neatly by renoise meta devices. Renoise’s meta device system and routingin instrument tracks is really neat compared to other daws (albeit the low resolution at lower lpbs).

Realistically we must remember that the renoise team is very very small, and renoisewith it’sdesign will never really sell like FL and other daws, and some things would simply require too much work to remake in another form, it’s safe to say that plugins is one of those things.

33

if its no 1996 anymore, than i guess all daws should have 1 common thing - getting shit together. most daws projects have samples all across hdd, some factory content somwhere else, vst folder, x32 x64 bit incompabillity. thats all results in crashes and a lot of precious time lost. i mean half of the problems starts with vst caused crash. no wonder more and more people moving into hardware and saying computers are unreliable, its not computers fault that it has impossible to manage all files and configs at once.

so…

Redux is available for Windows, OSX and Linux, in VST and AudioUnit formats. Your license does not restrict you to any particular platform, and is fully portable.

Faith in computers being restored.

Depends on how you work I guess. Having remote and local backup of everything, I’m rarely worried about assets. The DAW’s I use (Renoise, Logic, Live)keep single project files that are easily consolidated. If I worried, or just wanted to share a project, I’d only have to bounce/render/freeze as needed.

I agree that the level of containment and portability of using a single app or plug-in can be really useful. Especially when collaborating. Who knows/cares if relying on fewer plug-ins or apps is easier, better, safer, etc, on average…

To your point about getting shit done, I’m sure constraints like that help some be more crea- and productive, but I’d like having more options (specialized tools) for getting X done quicker with less effort, rather than fewer for getting X done slower with more effort. Even with realizing slower often yields better, more unique results. Since many times it isn’t an option. It’s between quicker with less effort and not at all. At least here. For instance I can make a lot of effort to model some .xrni that uses plug-in effects and/or instruments in Renoise, until I don’t miss any nuance, control, etc, and it’s completely sample-based and useable in Redux. I’d rather not though.

For ppl moving into hard- saying software is unreliable, I say try (VM) backups.

34

I feel like this is obvious, but the point of loading a VSTi in Redux would be to use Plugin Grabber. And to a lesser extent phrases.

35

I feel like this is obvious, but the point of loading a VSTi in Redux would be to use Plugin Grabber. And to a lesser extent phrases.

that would be a good reason to have both products from renoise :huh:

36

Well, phrases is a part of .xrni instrument, and for me is ultra useful for drumbreaks and some cool note effects.

i dont want any external vst support because i like solid clean approach,

if you made instrument once, it will allways work on any computer, no matter what age or OS it is, without - “shits not working because something vst is missing”

and why do even people want external vst/au support? for example you will use redux to load massive vst? isnt there more simple way to load your vst without loading it in another vst? :smiley:

keep it simple, keep it clean. thats the way to perfectionism IMO :drummer:

Not sure if I understand what you’re trying to say.

I can only speak for myself, but I won’t probably have a very great need of AU instruments in Redux, but I will have a great need of the Plugin Grabber. I think that would be a great thing with Redux.Carbonthief mentioned it too.

For instance: It’s a bit tedious to load Renoise with ReWire each time I just want to access that little synthriff-track with s/u/dxx commands for my Logic Project. Or my toms-track. Or whatever there might be.

I would probably be fine without the Plugin Grabber though, as there would perhaps be a quick workaround for it. But it would be handy indeed.

Perhaps you have other needs which Redux will fulfil. But last time I checked users are different and have different needs, generally. And by excluding great features is not really the same as keeping it simple.

37

we need to stop with the requests, because it could take another 2years in waiting :smiley:

lets see what it got!

38

we need to stop with the requests, because it could take another 2years in waiting :smiley:

lets see what it got!

That, on the other hand, I would sign. I actually said exactly this in the other thread. :slight_smile:

The effect was totally opposite thoughlol, if you keep on reading through the page there…

39

bigup to alpha testers for no leaks :smiley:

40

Hm… i still can’t get my head around it. Do i need another DAW now to use Audiotracks, drag n drop midi files and (bad word incoming:) Piano Rolls of my choise together with Renoise? Smart idea… So it’s not Renoise with Audiotracks but Audiotracks with Renoise? But I can not use patterns to create a whole Song? I can only use phrases with Redux?

I might have a closer look to Sonar again…

41

You always needed a DAW to use audiotracks, Renoise is a tracker, piano roll was always unlikely in Renoise, tracker users are so uptight about having that option for note input, it is a shame considering how stable Renoise is that it will most likely never have a piano roll or MIDI effects and so on, but a DAW with Redux is not far from that.

42

Bungle: IL Minihost modular is not enough?

43

IL minihost modular showed great potential but then unfortunately like every other IL product ever released it was left languishing in the “free updates for life” = “screw updating it, lets make something we can sell” quagmire.
I have an entire IL account to sell if you are interested, lots and lots of plugins and the big FLS :wink:

44

why on earth would you do that? i think redux is made to able edit and play xrni instruments in other daws. it is not meant to be renoise as a vst, but renoise instruments player.

i reaaly hope redux will not support vst into it, or tools or other external stuff, but will be solid sampler whitch with time will show a big middle finger to kontakt :smiley:

A few reasons. #1 to remix old amiga Mods in Logic for example. #2 Or just for nostalgic reasons like play a tracker song through Plogue’s chip crusher through a Paula chip in Logic. I would LOVE to find a tracker worth a crap as an AU plug-in but I’m not finding one. It would be very cool to be able to have all the awesome features of redux WITH at least a player. In this case if I am proven wrong it will make me happy! But it’s a feature wish and request.

45

A few reasons. #1 to remix old amiga Mods in Logic for example. #2 Or just for nostalgic reasons like play a tracker song through Plogue’s chip crusher through a Paula chip in Logic. I would LOVE to find a tracker worth a crap as an AU plug-in but I’m not finding one. It would be very cool to be able to have all the awesome features of redux WITH at least a player. In this case if I am proven wrong it will make me happy! But it’s a feature wish and request.

Well, don’t know if this is already possible, but a copy-paste mechanism to transfer pattern data from renoise to redux would be helpful. Or a midi import.What I am really wondering at is that the devs hardcoded lpb 4 (I alwaysuse 8 to easily write 32th notes, e.g. for rolls or arps). I guess it has reasons related to the gui (since there is no pattern scrolling in redux). lpb 4 just suxx, my two cents here. So for a copy-paste this lpb problem needs to be resolved first, right?

EDIT: Iwaswrong LPB is freelychoose able.

46

A few reasons. #1 to remix old amiga Mods in Logic for example. #2 Or just for nostalgic reasons like play a tracker song through Plogue’s chip crusher through a Paula chip in Logic. I would LOVE to find a tracker worth a crap as an AU plug-in but I’m not finding one. It would be very cool to be able to have all the awesome features of redux WITH at least a player. In this case if I am proven wrong it will make me happy! But it’s a feature wish and request.

I’d like to see this too. For workflow. It would lessen the resources used to port stuff, would make for more consolidated, self-contained projects and would make it a lot easier than having to manage many files (structure, etc). I’m hopeful about clipboard compatibility. In the meantime,ReWire is very workable for audio and (synced) MIDI transfer. To quickly get something out of what I have in Renoise, I’ve started having Redux in Logic triggered by MIDI sent from Renoise with ReWire sync. I guess in your case audiois the only option, if you want to retain column effects.

47

Another big difference is SFZ support in redux. Would like to see that brought into Renoise - or at least convert to XRNI format. The older convertors (such as Extreme Sample Convertor) don’t support the newer XRNI format (which supports layers, for one).

48

What I am really wondering at is that the devs hardcoded lpb 4 (I alwaysuse 8 to easily write 32th notes, e.g. for rolls or arps)

I’m not sure I get it - you are confusing ticks TPL and LPB here? LPB you can freely define per phrase, it’s only the internal DSP that relies on a fixed setting (it needs to, obviously).

Anyway, I think it would be nice to introduce an additional feature - a global tempo multiplier. So we take the BPM in Redux, which is fixed to the host anyway, and replace it with a little multiplier that automatically bumps the entire “internal tempo” up or down with the given factor (and by “entire tempo”, I mean that it should affect all phrases as well as the DSP effects for the entire preset).

49

Ups sorry, didn’t see it until now. Only read your previous post and misunderstood it obviously. So LPB is freely choose able :slight_smile: Nice. To be honest, I am completely no phrase user, since I edit anything not-live anyway.