What Would You Like To See In A Renoise 3.0?

Read why I explained audiotracks are a bad idea. The same is true for a piano roll.

You are forgetting about the amount of work needed to add fundamental changes to Renoise’s feature set. Not only do they have to code the thing,
they also have to keep supporting it (debugging, adding any features people request related to it). Adding a piano roll is opening a can of worms (or bugs, technically). It is a prime example of feature creep ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feature_creep ).

Your viewpoint is exactly what leads to software bloat: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_bloat
The idea that unused features are easily ignored is delusional. One only needs to compare an Apple product to a Microsoft product to see this.
I’m not even sure the development team is large enough to implement these things rigorously (or affordably).

Look, the developers have spent the time to implement ReWire so you can add another DAW for these features. They did this, I’m assuming, because they don’t want to make Renoise a vertical Cubase, or vertical Logic, or vertical FL Studio, or vertical Sonar, or vertical any of the other hundreds of DAWS that are designed for those things.

Hey NER can you please explain then why the developpers wrote that :

extracted from Renoise changelog :

#######################################################
################ Changes from Renoise 1.9.1 to 2.0.0
#######################################################
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Renoise 2.0 features Precision, Timing and Plugin improvements
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  • ready for the future: NoteDelays and LPB are the most important and necessary
    steps for upcoming big features like Zoomable Patterns, Piano Roll, more accuracy
    (timing wise) with FX automations, and so on.

Thanx

Better sub row editing (this could be pattern zoom, piano roll or negative delays in delay column).

Freezing and disk streaming, which probably happens when we get audio tracks.

Very interesting. Ok, I’m sending a link to the log, via PM. :slight_smile:

  1. A ‘remove noise’-option in the Sample Editor. I use audacity’s, but it would be awesome in Renoise.
    In fact, more options to remove sound artifacts.

  2. More drawing tools. Imagining something like Photosounder’s drawing options in the Sample Editor.
    Or even the possibility import images- convert em to sounds - edit - etc. Sorry, i just love that tool!

  3. A spectrogram in the Sample Editor.
    Btw- I love the spectrogram in the master Spectrum.

  4. Possibility to automate the Attack, sustain n release on samples.

  5. A rename all option, in the Instrument Settings/Sample. Like, if i wanted to remove the "VST"text-part from each n every single sample in the .xrni

  6. I dont know if its only me, but it can be hard to see the texture in the Pattern Editor on play. It gets fluffy. So maybe a more “floating” kind of thing. Or zoom in n out. I don’t know if it just me who need glasses. ;)

  7. Something like the Plug-in Grabber, but with DSPs on imported or created audio.
    Example, if i create a sample with the wonderful Padsynth, put on some DSPs - and then convert/render the hole deal to a .xrni.
    The “Process Track DSP’s” in the Sample Editor doesn’t do the job as well… And i have to do it on each and every single sample in the instrument. Would be nice with something that effected all the samples at one time.

  8. Monophonic/ “Chord Mode” in the Sample editor for each and every instrument slot. Maybe with some more glide options.

I am still a new-b to Renoise, and there are tons of things that i dont know about “yet”. And if its already possible to do some of the things I have mentioned in the above points, please let me know, as i am learning:)
And sorry for my english, but i hope it make sense.

Hi, when talking about, “noise,” have you tried using the gate? In your native dsp effects… Can you post a sound example of the noise you are trying to remove?

Doesnt the gate just effect the quiet part? Lets say that i have recorded a song from an old vinyl. There are a lot of “noise” like hiss, clicks n pops. With an “remove noise” tool you can grab that noise - learn it from a “quiet” part by the tool - and mute or delete it on the hole audio-file. The noise is also included in the audio itself. That’s the thing i would love to see in the Sample Editor.
But,. For my kind of purpose, it is the room noise, that also effect the audio in the sample.
I have an usb-mic and no kind of setup for recording. So loads of “room”-noise are included in the recordings which i hate.- but can be somehow removed with audacity’s remove noise.

but is that what a gate can do?

Because people bug them about it. Also, ReWire was added in version 2.1, after this changelog.
I said they probably don’t want to add a piano roll, not that they aren’t planning on adding one.
If I didn’t think that was a possibility I wouldn’t be arguing against it, obviously…

You come off as a spoiled consumer (and this is coming from an American).

<-- Doesnt the gate just effect the quiet part?

A Noise Gate is a volume related tool… When you have your signal above the threshold the door, “opens,” and below the thresh, “shuts.” In electronic music this is used to create trance, and pulsing bass, “the side chain effect.” ( beyond the scope of this post. )

<-- Lets say that i have recorded a song from an old vinyl. There are a lot of “noise” like hiss, clicks n pops. With an “remove noise” tool you can grab that noise - learn it from a “quiet” part by the tool - and mute or delete it on the hole audio-file.

While a noise gate, would not be great for a whole audio file, I would think, that depending on your type of music, a noise gate would be ideal here. You could gate out the noise, and have an organic sound, rather than audacity’s ultra destructive remove noise function, that has always sounded plastic to me, and is also not giving you great results. Trust me on that.

<-- But,. For my kind of purpose, it is the room noise, that also effect the audio in the sample.
I have an usb-mic and no kind of setup for recording.

I have seen some tools for vinyl, something from numark perhaps, that allows you to plug the phonograph into a usb port. Maybe look into the USB Turntable? Or quiet the room…

<-- So loads of “room”-noise are included in the recordings which i hate.- but can be somehow removed with audacity’s remove noise.

If this is what you are looking for; it is a, “feature request.” However, even though you may not hear them, with audacity’s tool, there are still artifacts from this type of recording, in your music.

Man, if they are really, really bugged, like you said, they dont want of it at all. And if they don’t want of it at all, man, they can allready delete the whole Pianoroll thread.

But…, why did you used the word “probably”, then ?

Are you really sure of what you’re saying ? You’re drawing conclusions, but about things that you can not definitively prove, and that’s why you added the word “probably”.

Concerning the PR, the devteam is exactly like this community : you’ll find members that want it, other ones that don’t want it, and other ones that have no opinion and wait & see, that’s all.

Now if the devteam don’t add all the ideas I’ve added in my wishlist, I will respect their free decision, and won’t call them “spoiled programmers”.

Translating the vertical pattern scheme to a pianoroll is quite a challenge, specially when having to incorporate effect columns with it because you should somehow group the notes that these effects apply to with colors. But you would also have to use the same color for the effects in the dsp panels that are applied to them and the send track contents if applicable. Owh, and the track groups should also somehow be applied.

Indeed. And this is not the only problematic thing about the PR mockup I did:

  • when selecting multiples notes from multiple colored instruments inside the vertical PR editor, the behaviour of the instruments FX automation on the right side isn’t clear ; the instrument fx “selector” only allows 1 instrument to be selected and edited, and not a group of instruments.
  • I didn’t though about colored notes that have to be edited and visually extended beyond the pattern border limits. Using a vertical PR would imply that the editor could drag colored notes over 2 different patterns,so the pattern should not look like distinct data blocks anymore, but they should look like continuous areas.
  • I didn’t thought about overlapping notes from different colors (how do they look ? how does it behave ? how is it edited ?).
  • Using this kind of editor implies realtime synchronized views. The classic pattern view has to be modified in realtime by the PR view, the PR view is modified by every change in the classic pattern view. Each edition step should require an analysis and a synchronisation between the two different views. It seems at first simple to imagine how a PR would automatically fill a defined track with notes for the same instrument : instruments are always associated to the same defined track. Selecting an instrument would select the associated track and display the associated DSP chains and automations on the bottom of the screen. BUT the opposite way could be a hell to code. Some xrns songs made with the same instruments placed on lots of different tracks, could not be automatically converted into a clear colored PR view without harming the DSP chains logic…

Guys, relax. We never said there absolutely will be a PR, neither we did said there absolutely will be none. We can’t. Please do not nail us down on something down like this.

Also this whole thread kinda runs out of control. The whole “Ideas & suggestions” forum is about “What would you like to see in Renoise - soon, 3.0, whatever - what’s important to you”. And we now have the this whole sub forum in one topic which only makes things harder to discuss.

So I’d suggest we’re closing this thread, and are going back using “Ideas & Suggestions” again. Don’t want to shut off any discussions, but avoid chaos.

Yes this topic should’ve been locked way back, it’s pointless & cluttered. If you’ve got a suggestion make a topic, if it already exists bump the existing thread.

I actually think this topic is good. People are freestyling and it has given me several ideas.

yes, you’re right it becomes a little bit messy in the end

Then let’s close it.
A lot of stuff discussed here has a pinned topic in the Ideas&suggestion forum so i would suggest to take a look at the top of that forum and continue submitting your ideas to those topics (including links to your brainstormed images).
If your topic is not pinned, then search for it using the advanced search feature and bump the existing threads that apply.