Any Reveal Sound Spire users here?

Spire from Reveal Sound is my best sounding plugin but Renoise always renders like Renoise has injected an immediate note-off on first note played. (not happening at very slow BPM)

Does this happen to you too? This is so ffn frustrating having to make a ghost pattern play phantom notes of all the spire instruments in song, then render WAV out, then truncate first pattern and crap crap… it is frustrating to the point where I suppose I have to buy Serum and ditch Spire. :frowning_face:

Sounds like the auto suspend mode is enabled. Then the plugin goes into suspend mode as soon no more sound is processed by the plugin. When you then play the first note, the plugin needs a short moment to “wake up” and this can cause such issues on the first played note.


Thanks but no luck, it still renders like there’s a note-off sent no matter what setting has been set.

Does the plugin introduce some latency? VSTis can do that, too. I wonder whether Renoise takes that into account or not…

I saw in your video that you are using not the latest version of Spire. I see it, because it has still the old preset popup list. There’s a new vesion out with a new much better preset browsing system and the update also has some bugfixes. Maybe this update can solve your problem.

Nice observation hehe … but I have updated after making the video and it still happens on latest version.

Can you render just fine??

I tested it now here. And you’re right. After rendering to song there’s a small “gap” on the first note on Spire. And after some experimenting i’ve also found the issue. It’s the poly mode of Spire. If the mode is set to other modes than to Poly 2 then you get these “gaps” on first note after rendering. If the mode is set to Poly 2 then all renders fine and there’s no gap anymore in the rendered file. It is definitely a problem with Spire, not with Renoise. Seems there’s a bug in Spire’s poly mode.

I can’t reproduce it, it happens with Poly 2 too. Maybe you changed something else?


I am happy to have found this topic as I am unfortunately encountering exactly the same problem with Spire.

Indeed, when rendering to .wav at low BPM this doesn’t happen.
(Maybe I have to change the genre of music I’m producing :slight_smile: lol (just kidding))

I am going to further inspect the workaround for this issue (by inserting a dummy note), that has been posted in the other topic regarding this issue First note missing from Render

In meantime I hope, that this issue will get solved by the Renoise developers.

Don’t get your hopes up, neither Spire nor Renoise developers show any interest in solving it.

Yes, what I usually do is insert a dummy note and set automation volume to zero, then I just turn up the volume when I introduce Spire but it’s obviously not great as you can’t begin a song with Spire.

By the way welcome to the forum :slight_smile:

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Did you render in realtime? If no, try it. If this also doesn’t help there is no help. Then you have to stick to your method with the first “ghost note” without any volume. Btw, this is also happening with a lot of free VSTs. But it shouldn’t happen with a commercial 149 $-VST like Spire…

Doesn’t make a difference.

I see… do you remember some names?

No, unfortunately not, it’s been too long. There was one C64 VST for sure, but I can’t tell any names. Ok, if rendering in realtime also doesn’t help, I claim there’s no help in this case. But it shouldn’t be a problem working with a “ghost note”, even if it’s annoying.

That’s a pity as I really like to use Spire.

Many thanks for your detailed instructions on how to use the dummy note.
And indeed, that works! :slightly_smiling_face:

It isn’t finally said, that you can’t begin a song with Spire. (This would be a dramatic restriction.)
I have a song, that begins with Spire - with a Bass - where this problem doesn’t occur.
But the other song, where this problem occurs, uses a Pad.

Many thanks. :smiling_face_with_three_hearts: I’m happy to be here.

Right, of course you can begin a song with Spire, even if the problem still exists. The only thing you have to do is to let the “ghost note” fade away completely before you turn the volume up again for the next note, the real first note of the song. It’s just the same like editing an empty pattern at the beginning of a song to avoid resonances and echoes while rendering. So just make sure the distance between the “ghost note” and the first note is long enough.

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Right :slight_smile:
Many thanks for your reply.

I just had exactly the same idea. You would then just have to cut the empty silent pattern at the start of the song containing the dummy note out of the rendered .wav file with an audio editor like Audacity for example.

And you don’t have to get the dummy note faded away. Just set the volume of that note to 0 / -INF dB in the volume envelope.

By the way:
I would like to add, that the term “ghost note” you are using here, should not be confused with the term “ghost note”, that is used by Renoise. Because in that case you delete the instrument number in the pattern editor.
But for the technique described here to solve the “Spire issue” it is important to keep the instrument / VST number in.

Ok, let’s call it “dummy note”. :wink:

Won’t work that way. You have to let the dummy note fade away completely, otherwise you will hear the rest of that note at the beginning of the next note, which you want to begin your song with, too. Adjusting the volume of the dummy note to 0 will only work with samples if you’re doing this in the pattern editor, but it won’t work with instruments. If you turn up the volume at the second note it’s still the same instrument than the dummy note, so of course you will also hear the rest of the dummy note if it’s not faded away completely. Same thing if you adjust the volume by automation, and it doesn’t matter if you’re going for the track’s volume or the instrument’s volume. The same instrument is affected, so the result will always be the same.

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Sorry for being over correct :wink:

Indeed, you are right!
Sorry, at my previous test of this technique I used the same note as “dummy note” as the later real note.
And I have used a Spire preset (instrument), where the effect you described here wasn’t noticed.

But, right, there are presets (instruments), where this will be heard.

So I think it will be best to put a Note-Off right after the “dummy note” to get it faded out as early as possible.
Because some presets (instruments) are infinite.

Many thanks for correcting me! :slight_smile:

You’re welcome! :slightly_smiling_face:


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I bet it occurs but because you likely use a short bass note you don’t hear it well.
The issue is Renoise must send a note-off immediately after first note played by Spire, so it won’t be a huge issue if you intend to have a short initial sound.