Fair enough.
I don’t know, 10,000 users sounds like an okay estimate and its totally feasible given the dev team size. Roughly 7 years between major releases at 10k users (most probably bought their licenses at some point in 2.x) times the price for a full major release cycle, divided by the number of devs would be plenty for some decent residual income on the side, but in no way would make money a non-issue and certainly would not turn our wonderful dev team into full-time Renoise coders. If Renoise was gaining 10k users a year, maybe it would be a different story. As users, we’ve got to take into account that funding software development isn’t a one-to-one pay per feature system. Instead, we trade cash for the devs to use their time to build an infrastructure where an already large number of features can co-exist and integrate with each other. I think a Kickstarter to open source renoise is asking someone to put a price on their own time, when some portion of that time is spent not purely out of cubicle work, but joy and passion for making music. I’m not against open sourcing, but it makes no sense to me to crowd fund the purchase of what may be someone’s life work/passion project. Could renoise use some more development help? Absolutely and never soon enough. Is renoise a complex system that can be expanded by throwing money at it? Sure, but it has to be done deliberately and with respect to the project and its intentions. Is there opportunity for third-party development and expansion through collaboration with other firms? Yes, and we’ll have to show Renoise is a worthy product not by building out the feature request list, but by exposing Renoise for the brilliant piece of software that it already is, and attracting new users to the community not through alluring them to obscurity but by showing them how its merits might be just the thing they are looking for in their music production workflows.
1 Renoise is not that special.
2 Trackers are not that special.
3 All the other pieces of software out there that are selling well and have good support systems, they are special, and pretty much all of them do what a tracker can do, plus they do what they are good for in their particular field.
4 And this is the grand daddy of it all, nobody cares, other musicians are actually generally happy with their workflow and again generally are not “looking” for something as you put it, and even if they where, I doubt very much it would be typing hex hahaha, the developers here actually don’t care, I see no hint from them that the end is near, development will be stopping in the next 3 days, download quick we are shutting down the servers.
There seems to be this utter nonsense strain running through this forum that Tracking is actually something quite quite special, well reality check, it isn’t, it is just tracking, yes it is fun, and if fun is not enough for you, then go find an open source tracker that gets updated once every 10 years, trust me, they are all in a worse place than Renoise is, there seems to be this general panic around here that we need more users, we need more developers, did you ever think that the developers that we have could be out busy doing other work to make a living, or they may even be making music, and here is the kicker, if any of you think that any of the Renoise team don’t on a regular basis, probably just as much if not more, use other hosts like Live or ProTools or Cubase and so on, then i tell you now, you are kidding yourself !!
The only way I can imagine Renoise being open source is when the license would be non-copyleft and would read like this:
You may work on this code if the following condition is met:
The money, surplus, improvement that arises from the work that you do with this code is intended to go to the current Renoise team.
Money => current Renoise team
In case one of the current developers might ask if I had NO problem working for another ones fortune and getting 0 cent, and not forking it commercially: Yes, totally. No problem with that kind of license. It’s Renoise.
And if you wonder if open source means instant death: No. Look at Xara LX, all they had to do is keep the rendering component CDraw a secret. The open source version “died”, the whole project per se was not harmed.**
Lately that graphics software that was used to create Futurama was open sourced. They go on with their commercial version afaik. And looking at Android, I don’t think actually it’s all like it used to be.
**IMHO if the DSP code would stay closed source, that would be actually no problem for improving the code base around it, except for some rare things like improving automation. But actually I think it’s all about the license anyway.
removed
Hm, to prove this point I would be tempted to create a kickstarter campaign only to see it stall far from your suggested sum.
Please do.
If one software product is worth my extra money, it’s gotta be Renoise. I would love to donate.
edit:
same ideas (sort of);
Renoise Development Boost Donation
How Do I Donate To Renoise?
Buy Your Vote(s)!
Renoise Fundraiser
Why I’m showing you guys al these topics? To let y’all know this userbase is WILLING to donate money.
This userbase never complains about the cost of Renoise.
Nobody is whining about the price of Renoise is too damn high.
People are WILLING to donate money.
WILLING.
Voluntarily.
Do something with that knowledge.
Bungle wow another fart in the air…
What ?
Is that an attempt at some constructive criticism of a post, wait , am i using too many syllables for you ?
How can I ignore a user in this forum (such that I will not see his/her posts anymore)? Cannot find the button.
You cannot ignorel the Stimulationsebern in a forum, it is just meant to be this way - to make you breed the ultimate forum procrastination skills ever & spread them on all around the globe by becoming a fkn Eber yourself.
What ?
Is that an attempt at some constructive criticism of a post, wait , am i using too many syllables for you ?
No, sorry. Maybe just too little punctuation marks…I misunderstood you. Maybe I just don’t like the way you communicate because I cannot stand that massive amount of coolness. But that’s my problem. Nevermind.
Hello renoisers,
since the Renoise team always says that are too few people to add the wised features and doing bugfixes quickly, what if Taktik would start a Kickstarter campaign to make Renoise open source?
If the goal is reached, he could make the source available no github.
What is all the work in Renoise worth in money value? What do you estimate? I would estimate 1 million euro.
maybe im not such a renoise professor/bug discoverer/millionaire as you,
but i can’t see the need for this.
renoise will go s**t if go open source.
get off your hands of it please!
i went through many systems for music and i stopped at renoise for it being stable, fast and exclusive cool peace of software.
excellent work. no need for updates for me currently.
if thing goes to too many open sourced hands, it just gets more problems on board, unnecessary slowing down features, more updates, more fixes, more shitty developers speculating with stupid addons/plugins.
i think this post is a big troll thing among others, that comes here and there on forum attempting to inject stupid multipurpose s**t in the heads of renoise developers.
please dont be an enemy of great working stable renoise. dont ruin it.
f$$k $ff with your wise features. sorry
To be fair - I think it was a post of someone disappointed by the slow speed of development & lack of communication (expecially in advance) from the dev team concerning what is planned and already in the forge. This pissed me off a while, too, but now I get by & just chill and wait for things to happen & people to troll around.
Fun fact: renoise is based on an open source tracker. And the original tracker’s mit license made the current commercial & closed source state valid. Go to the menu bar “help”->“About” and read the text, then do research, then say “Oh”…
Open sauce?
maybe im not such a renoise professor/bug discoverer/millionaire as you,
but i can’t see the need for this.
renoise will go st if go open source.
get off your hands of it please!
i went through many systems for music and i stopped at renoise for it being stable, fast and exclusive cool peace of software.
excellent work. no need for updates for me currently.
if thing goes to too many open sourced hands, it just gets more problems on board, unnecessary slowing down features, more updates, more fixes, more shitty developers speculating with stupid addons/plugins.
i think this post is a big troll thing among others, that comes here and there on forum attempting to inject stupid multipurpose st in the heads of renoise developers.
please dont be an enemy of great working stable renoise. dont ruin it.
f$$k $ff with your wise features. sorry
Ah C’mon man, what kind of rubbish is this now? How old are you? 13 and in the puberty? I never said I would put hands on the code, since I don’t believe that I have taktik s skills and knowledge.
Handling an open source project can be a good or a bad thing and highly depends on the politics of the maintainer and also on the chosen license model. Most projects benefit from such a step. And everybody who wants could at least try to contribute.
Well, and regarding making suggestions, yes maybe I made too much already, but then just don’t read it, it’s just an idea and won’t harm you physically. Don’t be afraid, nobody will be injured or badly influenced.
This thread wasn’t meant as trolling, but as a serious idea. Kinda starts to get on my nerves that some of you try to turn almost every thread into shit.
And now fuck off yourself.
Are you for real ?
Are you just on this forum to bad mouth off in various threads ?
What exactly is your ploy ?
I think shall go back to my coolness, whatever that nonsense means ?
Try getting over yourself for a few minutes and realise that you are not the only person on planet earth, because to be perfectly honest, every single other existence on this planet is showing more decorum than you.
Intense. I don’t think I’ve seen this sort of interaction on the forums before.
While we’re doing the whole off topic thing, I’ve been pretty into pretzels dipped in hummus lately.
Was also sort of into the constructive discussion of an interesting topic, regardless of my personal opinions on the matter or on anyone else posting.
Maybe I should start a “favorite studio snacks” thread?
Edit: done. I can assure you no political gesture has been made in this post.
Absolutely, enjoy the studio snacks or bring them into the park.
Oh, and something I’d totally back on Kickstarter would be a Linux-basedunit capable of running Renoise in near-zero latency
It should have multiple inputs, output and be euro-rack mountable.
Open source hardware is also a thing.
Do you mean kind of general audio linux daw computer?