I’ve brought this up before in some capacity, and i’m sure others have as well. But i’ll just try it again, in more condensed form.
I’d like to see a meta device that lets you add/remove an arbitrary amount of sliders, and map an arbitrary number of other effect chain parameters to any one of them, within a certain range with a certain offset, as well as apply a simple math modifier (invert, for instance).
Controls that alter multiple parameters in one operation would severely simplify complex automation. That was a cool sentence.
In layman’s terms, this would give you one slider that when increased will increase filter cutoff, lower filter resonance, crossfade reverb wet/dry, flip a gainer’s stereo image, whatever. With one midi assignable/automatable operation.
What is the easiest way to implement this currently?
It looks as though the current logic only allows one effect parameter per midi-cc, rather than one midi-cc per parameter (which has no real purpose). We need to be able to assign multiple parameters, ranges, to one midi-cc.
I generally rely on the ability to control many different parameters with one midi controller. Ableton supports this. Also, I am fortunate that using pure-data, I can have one midi control send any number of ranges and parameters, getting me around this limitation in renoise.
What are some imaginative ways this could be implemented without changing too much?
Perhaps rather than the midi mapping window displaying what parameter is currently mapped to the selected midi-cc (limiting it to only one), it could display a dropdown list of currently mapped parameters, which selecting an item from displays the parameter’s assigned midi-cc; where i can be further edited (range etc.).
That way, each parameter can have it’s own specific channel, cc, range/invert, etc, and it wouldn’t limit the number of times a channel/cc can be reused.
For me, this isn’t necessarly used for “morphs”, but in a large number of different useful ways. When I use game controllers, I can have an analog control two parameters each of four different effects, while the abxy select which effect is on or off.
Also… I suppose it’s good to get a warning that a channel/cc is already in use! Similar to keybindings, but that should only be important to people who are overly reckless/forgetful with their assignments.
+1 @ multiple parameter mapping to 1 slider, would be cool if right click recording this 1 slider, would automatically draw in ALL the linked automation data as well.
I’m with Sunjammer on this, and in my mind it does not need to be an overly complex concept, in fact it’s rather simple. I’ll also take an educated guess here based on the LFO Device and the Velocity Device, and say that Renoise already has the necessary technology for this “Multi Map Device” to exist without writing a huge amount of new code. (I don’t mean that to sound presumptuous, I just want to stress the fact that this wouldn’t be some amazingly complicated new thing, it is really just an extension of some existing features)
Here’s a very quick sketch off the top of my head. I’m sure this could be improved and cleaned up, but hopefully you get the idea:
The “Input” parameter is obviously what you’d automate in your patterns and/or assign a MIDI CC to, to control all the other “Dest” parameters.
We have some basic mapping adjustments to fine tune things, as already found in other existing devices.
In the bottom/right corner of the device there is an arrow button to expand and show more destinations/mappings, behaving in the same way as the current MIDI CC Device. Alternatively, you can simply map one of the “Dest” parameters to the “Input” of yet another Multi Map Device, to daisy chain as many as you need.
So, yeah… no complex stuff going on here… no fancy additional logic to hurt your brain… it’s all using stuff which already exists in Renoise.
(Edit: I just realised that an “Invert” feature probably isn’t necessary here, since we can simply change the range from 00-FF to FF-00 and achieve the same result)
Thanks for the excellent draft (well, as usual ). This is indeed not much work as we already have all the components, while the feature would be damed useful!
One thing you could not do with this device is controling/morphing FX from different tracks (for example to crossfade volumes of mutiple tracks). This could only be done with MIDI mappings.
How come you can’t make it so we can point metadevices at different tracks taktik? … just wondering
And yes, this device would make my life immensely easier. For ages now, I’ve been longing to do stuff like apply a single LFO to multiple parameters… I think this device fits in with the simple but powerful tools idea that sunjammer mentioned a while back… and I’m definitely looking forward to seeing it implemented
It has four slots of three-way distributors (but it’s easy to add more should the need arise). The top orange sliders respond to incoming MIDI messages as set by channel and controller number. The curves below are the X->Y mappings for each of the outputted controller messages. This is what I specifically needed - to be able to transform the incoming message according to any function. And all the other MIDI information is also passed through.
I find it great for live jamming. You can set up channel crossfades, or set up several effects to morph between each other, you can even send control to a visualization app. Anything.
One way of integrating something like this in Renoise might be making an entirely new screen dedicated to global control. Most probably much more work will be needed than dBlue’s idea, but arbitrary function mapping is very powerful and you get outside the single track scope.
good idea, but isnt this just ultimately another limited feature which would be better achieved by a modular interface of some kind (or a means to rewire all paremeters with an existing modular interface such as max/msp or PD)? I know the modular thing would take a lot more work, but aren’t we going to end up with just a muddled stack of assorted esoteric features to do this kind of thing otherwise? If we can’t have modular though, i’m all for this
Gotta learn to walk before you can run
I definitely look forward to the day when Renoise might be fully modular, but until that day arrives I’ll definitely take this functionality!
sorry at first. i didnt read the whole thread. but sunjammer’s idea
reminds me of ‘snapshots’ (eg: buzz or reaktor) where the user can
set a inertia as timespan for ‘morphing’ between them.
I’m actually surprised I never missed an option like this.
The endless possibilities would be multiplied by infinity, hurrah!
I don’t think it would necessarily require a math modifier of some sort,
but it would definately make it a whole lot more useable. Not to mention
confusing for those few who have digit-dyslexia like me.
). This is indeed not much work as we already have all the components, while the feature would be damed useful!
