Bug: Redux Phrase prints off grid when bouncing to audio

Just checked and can confirm it happens in Reason on Win 10 and Mac (10.15).
Just checked in Studio 1 also:

Screenshot 2022-11-07 at 20.52.22

I have the same issue with Redux 1.3.2 on Ableton, Bitwig, and Logic using MacOS. Would love to see this fixed. Downgrading to 1.2.2 is an OK workaround but there’s some bug fixes that were added in versions > 1.2.2 that addressed similar timing issues when Beatsync is enabled

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Do the daws you use offer any plugin delay compensation? Is there a difference if you turn this on/off?

Bitwig has it built in so there is no way of turning it off. I would rather see it fixed rather having to mess with PDC. The better workaround for me at the moment is downgrading to the last version that didn’t have this issue.

I understand, just trying to a/b the problem. Is there a difference if you use dsp effects in the redux instrument vs having no effects and rendering out a stem?

Nope, the images I posted on the originals and subsequent posts just a single copy of Redux nothing else and a vanilla kick drum.

To be clear, I mean effects used inside redux like;

Nothing just a kick drum. To be honest. I understand that this is a low priority bug but the lack of acknowledgement, even just to say yep we are aware but consider this a low ranking would be nice. I have submitted a bug rep via the form btw.
Also try it for yourself. New project daw of choice (We have tried Bitwig,Live,Reason and Studio One) Bog standard kick 4 to the floor pattern and bounce it out and see the delay.

Can confirm in renoise using the render pattern selection to sample silence is introduced;

Same when rendering to stems from the songs tab in the diskop;

Through some manual cutting, things can be fixed, but not ideal of course.

Just to add a bit more detail: I have tried many different combinations of disabling PDC, using manual delay compensation, using fixed buffer plugins like Audio Latency Compensation Plugin [VST, AU, AAX] - Latency Delay - Voxengo , and reporting the issue to the Renoise support email. Nothing has worked so far. The oddest thing is that I’ve noticed the latency can be variable as well — if it was a fixed delay, that’s be easy enough to work around, but it’s not.

I really love Redux as a plug-in but for what I do and how I use Redux, this bug makes it unusable for me in a live situation and in the studio.

Redux newbie here. I just discovered and reported this bug too (Mac here). glad to see it’s not just me who is experiencing it.

The sampler itself is in time, but the phrase patterns are not.

Also I am getting some really weird things happen when trying to trigger phrases from my DAW, like strange patterns being triggered that i didn’t even make. Very bizarre.

one question - when in keymap or program mode, am I right to think that the computer keyboard (with redux focused) does NOT trigger the patterns? But the computer keyboard with DAW focus DOES ? This is super doing my head in and trying to gradually piece together what is going on. Seems when my caps lock is on I am getting some kind of conflict with both systems trying to function.

Best
Dale

I believe that’s how it works that qwerty with the focus on Redux will only trigger slices. Not sure which daw you are using. I always draw in the gated notes to trigger the phrase.

For Bitwig/Abe I also make sure I use a note transposer that transposes the inputted midi note.

For example If you put a phrase starting at C1 in Redux that’s actually C-1 in the piano roll in the DAW. So what o do is pop the transposer tool so it intercepts the midi note and pushes it down 2 octaves.

That allows me to draw a note in the piano roll at C1 and it fires the phrase mapped to C1. I believe in theory that’s what you need to do if you are using the DAW virtual keyboard too.

Also have a look in the settings part of Redux. I believe there is something around having to use double caps lock for some DAWs

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Thank you for the detailed reply Darlo. Appreciated

Did it help though :slight_smile:

yes thanks, although i think they could improve the behavour somewhat, at least allow the toggle of which keyboard has priority (but maybe that’s a daw dependant thing. I use bitwig)

the main issue they need to fix however is the bouncing being out of time. I wrote to support but not sure if they reply. Time will tell. Best

I just downgraded to 1.2.2

Sorry for the very late reply.

This has indeed been broken with the fix for Unstable timing (jitter) of VSTi MIDI routed events in the latest updates. I’ll try to fix that soon, while trying not to break the other fix mentioned.

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This problem has also has been pointed by @moloko in other two topics. There are workarounds, but not full on solutions. Some of it seems to be intended behavior, as stated by taktik in how the processing works (the fx are applied over the raw sample and then repitched, so if you have finetuned the sample before applying dsp the output will sound different).

What I currently do is use RollingSampler for everything… I don’t even touch the “render fx” and “resample” buttons in Renoise anymore. I just hit play and then drag and drop from RollingSampler to Renoise.

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Ooh, nice. Rolling sampler looks super useful :+1: Thanks for the heads up

Thank you for taking the time to respond. I’m glad it’s on your radar, and hopefully not a massive amount of rework and regression testing needed.