Sample Envelopes

Hi!
It would be very nice indeed to have an option to bind an envelope to sample in addition to make global instrument envelopes that effect the whole range of samples loaded into one instrument. That would make f.ex. enveloping drum kits much more versatile. With current behavior it is pretty much impossible, because of course you don’t want same envelope to affect your crashes, hihats, snares and bass drums. Could have much more usage and would make a big positive difference to RNS sampler functionality.

hell yea! envelopes should be sample related, not instrument slot…its reeeeally stupid how it is now wurkin.i just cant get.

now when im layering my stuff, i huv to waste sample slots to get independent envelopes for each one, INSTEAD ov that i could group same samples under one instrument ans still i would get independent envelope for every sample…peace!

edit: offtopic

ok, *1+1 by me, so Kameleontti will not get upset :P

Now that’s more like it. Your vote is important too. :P

+1

I end up having to split my drums up or use a gate because of this.

+1

individual envelopes would be great, as it is i almost don’t use them in instruments featuring more samples

Multiple envelopes per sample would be a sweet feature! :)

yopp +1

Yeah, +1.
I believe I’ve also suggested something similar… a simple volume envelope inside the sample editor. That would be enough to me, especially if you could also tweak the envelope with the sample displayed in the background (for orientation).

Yes I believe I have seen an illustration about something like that on these forums, if I remember correctly. It was very long time ago. Anyway that would be a good idea, to draw envelopes on samples. The question is, would it be better to have independent looping points for samples and envelopes or would it be better to loop the envelope (if desired) according to sample loop? Personally I see usage for both of these options, but then again it would be confusing to draw an envelope on sample and then having it loop differently than sample, making them “out of phase”. So how about ability to just see the sample envelope on sample if wanted? Toggling this feature on and off would solve all problems.

However this may be exactly the thing that ermi was getting at.

The way I see this could work is like this:

  1. The Instrument Editor would pretty much stay as it is right now. Those envelopes would still affect all the samples.
  2. The Sample Editor would be enhanced by some extra controls: VOL, PAN, … which would be displayed as envelopes with the sample in background. Those envelopes would act non-destructively, just like the Instrument envelopes… aka you could just turn them off, and the sample would play as by default.
    The Sample envelopes would be tied to the sample (for speed/length), while the Instrument envelopes would still be tied to the song tempo, like now. So the Sample and Instrument envelopes, although similar in what they do, would be two separate functions, independent of each other. (Kinda like pre/post-FX volume,… you get the picture.)

As an addition to all this, one could also have the option of many “Instrument envelopes”, like one per sample. I think that’s what you meant in the first post, Kamaleontti. (correct me if I’m wrong) Why not, I guess… But IMO that could be a bit too much, or not worth the trouble.*
And even then, if only this was implemented, I still think it would be useful having envelopes, which are tied to the sample, for easy and accurate tweaking of the sample.

*Why not worth the trouble? Because if there was enough control on a per-sample basis, the need for individual -song tempo based- envelopes would be smaller.

Just my 0.02€.

Okay. Correction:
That was not what I meant.
I meant that there would be global Instrument envelopes possible affecting all the samples in the instrument and then there would be sample envelopes that would affect only the sample. Just as You described.

About the timing, yes, sample envelopes would not be very clever to tie in tempo maybe, since it would make them less accurate. In the other hand if there would be flexible enough curve drawing tools it would propably not matter. And bind the sample envelope timing to sample? You mean 44100hz sample would have 44100 possible sample envelope points per second? And 96khz would have 96000 points per second in turn? Wouldn’t that be a bit overkill?

I don’t think anyone needs more than ms based timings with snap-option, bezier automation curves and a tempo grid. Would fill all my possible needs 110% for sure. Of course more accurate timing wouldn’t hurt, so the implementation would be left to developers to decide, I can’t say which would be easier to do and more lightweight for system.

No, I meant sample as the .wav file, not related to sample rates. So I agree 1ms or something would probably be enough… and after all it would be nice if you could also use some tempo-based snap as part of the ruler etc.
If you know NI Battery you can see that it has some similar controls tied to the sample. Although for volume it only uses some simple ADSR controls, whereas I’d prefer if in Renoise you could draw a volume envelope more freely.

And while He would be at it He could change the Instr. Envelopes obeying milliseconds instead of ticks. And put the the snap grid to there too.

+1 for additional snap options. I’m all for it.

+1… AND an envelope metadevice which can envelope any DSP/VST’s parameters based on pattern’s note triggers :P (I started a thread on that once)

I think I have done that too.
So thumbz up for that!

+1

I’d also like to see a “master tuning” button alongside this for the clips…

Here’s my idea for the *parenting Renoise instrument (that actually seems might have been your idea aswell in the first place… heh…)

And Kameleontti I hope you don’t feel like I’d like to misguide the discussion on your topics. (?) I just think our ideas are somewhat on the same wavelenght and therefor our topics seem to overlap =)

[quote="#<0x0000562852bff858>, post:19, topic:19306"]

+1



I’d also like to see a “master tuning” button alongside this for the clips…



Here’s my idea for the *parenting Renoise instrument (that actually seems might have been your idea aswell in the first place… heh…)



And Kameleontti I hope you don’t feel like I’d like to misguide the discussion on your topics. (?) I just think our ideas are somewhat on the same wavelenght and therefor our topics seem to overlap =)
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Yes I see these all connected, approaches to desired improvements in xrni. There are practical similarities and differences. Discussion this is.</0x0000562852bff858>